Is this a true statement?

45flint · October-10-10 19:10

"It is estimated that in approximately 92% of firearms self-defense situations, no shots are fired; the appearance of the gun is enough to stop the action." This was on another website. If true it would argue that having a gun is the most important aspect of self defense and we spend most of our time worrying about which one is the best.

Steve

sirbarkalot · October-10-10 20:10

Yea, you are right............. a lot of to-do over nothing. Most important part is to be armed. I suspect that is why the NAA minis are so popular...........



   But not with the "big gun" crowd.



   Barky

stungun · October-10-10 21:10

I've actually heard some statistics about why a guy DIDN'T carry a gun.



   He said that 4 out of 5 people who RUN manage to get away.



   And 4 out of 5 people who DO get shot in the back don't die.



   Pretty good odds.

mrmadhat · October-10-10 21:10

lol beats scratch games

Uncle_Lee · October-11-10 04:10

I have 2 steel knees-can't run, so I'll just stay and fight.

chopprs · October-11-10 04:10

I am too old to run anyway so somene is gonna have their hands full if they want to try and take my wallet. All of the training that I have ever taken says not to remove the gun from the holster unless you are prepared to kill someone. Thinking that you are just going to waive it around and scare peeps away is a very bad forethought, it will likely get you killed. I HATE when someone posts that statistic because it makes peeps think this......

Uncle_Lee · October-11-10 04:10

If you pull it, shoot it.

   Time for talk is over.

   If you don't shoot it, you just might loose it.

   I haven't had any "formal" training. That's just how Dad taught me to do it.

45flint · October-11-10 04:10

I bet painting them with a laser would take it up to 99.9%.

chopprs · October-11-10 06:10

.......wow!

unclenunzie · October-11-10 06:10

People can tell if you are ready to take serious action, it shows up in body language. If you take it out you need to be prepared to use it for real. THEN the 80% thing might apply, at least this is how I see it.



   Some percentage will back off upon seeing a weapon no matter what. The ones that won't back off need to see you are prepared to shoot. Most of them will back away if you give off readiness body language. The remaining who can see you will shoot, but still have not backed off, are the ones to be 100% ready for.



   just my personal, inexperienced opinion

chopprs · October-11-10 07:10

"Painting" someone with a laser should ONLY be a one second precursor to pulling the trigger. "Painting" someone with a laser and then waiting to see what they will do will provide two things.

   One: it will show the perp where you are without any doubt and then

   Two: give him something to shoot at.

   This method of attempting to scare someone with a laser will get you shot!

moderndayidiot · October-11-10 07:10

When I am out plinking with my BW

   along the river, I always keep one

   rat shot in the cylinder for in case

   someone tries to rob me or beat me

   up for shooting their dog or something.



   If they come up to me, I pull it out

   and shout "you dirty rat" so they will

   know I have rat shot in it.



   most of the time, they still beat me up,

   but no one has taken my wallet. Then

   they usually just walk away after saying

   a bunch of stuff about what they think

   I did to their dog. Of course I don't

   usually have any money in my wallet

   anyway.



   I was thinking about getting one of

   those laser pointers to go on my BW

   so I could paint them with it.



   Anyway, that is just how I do it.



   --$MDI$

redhawk4 · October-11-10 09:10

I think shining your laser on someone is another way to get you killed. As has been said if the gun comes out you should only be thinking about firing, not whether your laser dot will make the guy poop his pants.



   Yes most people will run away when you pull a gun out, who wouldn't, particularly if they don't have a gun. If they do, whether you have yet seen it or not, when you pull your gun you raise the stakes the other guy is now in a you, or him situation and will act accordingly. If you are playing the "I wonder if this will scare him game" he is more likely to win IMO. How do you know the BG will even see the laser dot on him if you are aiming where you need to.



   Lasers are to help you hit what your aiming at, if it's your preferred sighting system and for nothing else IMO.



   I've learned in confrontations of any sort to try and not to look or act scared and to try to exude confidence, even if you are really scared. This will often allow you to talk your way out of a situation and will help to convince your foe that you are not just going to be a passive victim which will have him questioning if he wants to tangle with you or go elsewhere. In my experience no one wants to get in a fight, in a fight you'll get hurt even if you win, there are lots of people however who like to just beat the crap out of some defenseless victim who doesn't or can't fight back so don't act like one even if in reality you really don't fancy your chances.



   I had a big shaven headed tatooed guy in a wife beater get up, actually apologise to me the other day in a road rage incident caused by him honking at me to turn left before the cars coming the other way had stopped. We were both turning into the same parking lot. He got out looking all tough and I did think "Oh Crap" inside, but just stood there and he backed down and apologised when I politely explained I couldn't turn because people were running the red light.

ephraim · October-11-10 09:10

Wow. Uncle lee you sound like Clint Eastwood in Outlaw Josie Wales. Sure do like that movie! I do believe you have the right idea. I can't stand these TV/movies that show two people with guns pointing at each other while they have a long conversation. How dumb is that?

E!

cedarview kid · October-11-10 10:10

If I can run, even if I have a gun, I'm probably gonna try that first.

redhawk4 · October-11-10 10:10

Ephraim +1 on Josie Wales one of my all time favorites.

Uncle Lee, 2 steel knees - I guess one of those to the privates could do some damage if you have to stay and fight

   NAA, running and avoidance is always the best option in the right circumstances.



   "Those who fight and run away, live to fight another day"

stainless1 · October-11-10 11:10

In law enforcement (uniformed) I drew my weapon at least daily, sometimes more. On radio calls, traffic stops, or just when a gut feeling told me that deadly force maybe necesary. In 34 years, I fired shots on two occasion, one being fatal. I feel that drawing my weapon many of those times prevented the situations from escalating into a deadly force situation. In plain clothes or while undercover, if I drew my weapon, I also took my badge out and held it high for all to see and verbally identified myself. This was so officers from other agencies who may have responded to 911 calls would recognize me as a peace officer and not a "man with a gun" It is very dangerous to have a weapon in hand when the troops roll in if you're not in uniform. For that reason, the average civilian is at a distinct disadvantage.

I am now retired, and carry an issued wallet which contains retirement credentials exempting me from my state's concealed and loaded gun laws, and a flat badge same as an active officer's but with "RETIRED" across the top. If I was to draw my weapon now, I would also display the badge and it may keep me from being mistaken for the bad guy with the gun. I've been retired for 7 years and haven't needed to draw my weapon and hopefully I won't ever have to. Stainless

theysayimnotme · October-11-10 11:10

"People can tell if you are ready to take serious action, it shows up in body language."

It even works for dogs. Whenever I pulled the pepper spray the dogs seemed to know it was some kind of weapon & stayed back. Somehow they even seemed to know how far back to stay. They would continue to bother me but stay out of range of the spray. The satchel is actually far more useful than the spray.

redhawk4 · October-11-10 12:10

That's true for dogs, they say a dog can smell fear, I don't know about that, but again if you don't act afraid even though you're puckered up their charge at you stops before they get to you and some of them even have the cheek to want to approach you for some fuss and a belly rub.

stungun · October-11-10 13:10

Dogs are the only animal that can read human facial gestures/reactions.

So, you give them a mean mug without the pepper spray, and they'll still be afraid of a swift kick to the kidney...

therevjay · October-11-10 16:10

I pretty much agree with "Chopprs". Pulling out the gun MAY solve the problem. But if your not willing to use it, leave it in your pocket and run. I would try backing off first. Actualy turning your back to run is probably not a good plan. (unless you are positive you can outrun the threat)

niterider · October-11-10 19:10

1. True statement: a person with a gun who is unwilling to fire is more a danger to themselves than they would be without the gun.

2. True statement: beware of statistics...they often reflect the beliefs of the statistician more than reality.

lewiss · October-11-10 20:10

Like some of the other "more mature" members of the board, I am in no condition to run, thus my Handicap Parking tag. So if someone wants to attempt to relieve me of my possessions with force, I will be "in fear for my life" and fire off a round or two as necessary. Not in the air, not after waiving the gun, not after trying to run, but as fast as I can draw, aim and fire. Proper procedure is for the perp to hit the ground dead or dieing before he has noticed the gun.

redhawk4 · October-11-10 21:10

"Proper procedure is for the perp to hit the ground dead or dieing before he has noticed the gun".

A sound plan Lewiss, and IMO anyone who cowardly attacks a "more mature" person deserves no less than what you intend to dish out.

chopprs · October-11-10 21:10

The polls "statistically" show that Obama has a chance in the next election.......



   ......YEAH, OK!?!?!?!



   Statistics are not always correct nor do they give the entire picture.

45flint · October-12-10 04:10

If the statement is true and my gut is that it is, I really don't see how you can say that pulling out a gun even if you have no intention of using it puts you in a worst position. Over 9 out of 10 times you walk away better off. If they gave you those odds in Las Vegas we would all be there. I think if you argue against this you have to be saying the above is not true, which is the orginal question, I guess.

chopprs · October-12-10 05:10

Flint, it is all about split second timing. In a quick decision moment you have lost before you begin if you train yourself to do what is not a situation that you come out living in any scenario. While that statistic may be correct it does not speak anything about how mny times someone saved their own life or someone elses by being prepared to shoot. One saved life beats out ALL the others in my book, ESPECIALLY IF IT IS MY LIFE!!!!!!!

You can go on thinking that just waiving a gun around will save you. We will read about you in the paper.

I don't mean to be so blunt but you can ask ANY and I mean ANY trainer and they will tell you that!

clipper1 · October-12-10 15:10

...2 "Tin" knees,+ a collection of hardware holding L-3 & L4 together,kinda' puts Me in the same catagory W/Uncle_Lee..If possible,(without shedding ALL self respect)walk away..If You are "Packing", You darn well better be psychologically & physically READY TO USE IT, without 2nd. guessing Your decision...

Uncle_Lee · October-13-10 05:10

Edited

clipper1 · October-13-10 20:10

...Edited? WOW!! THAT must be one heck of a "Post"...

Uncle_Lee · October-14-10 05:10

Not really. Just went over my posts and it DID sound like I was whining and I have never been a whiner.

The written word can never be understood the same as spoken word because the reader can't see the facial expressions and body language.

coopercdrkey · October-14-10 07:10

"Beware of statistics.... They often reflect the beliefs of the statistician more than reality"

What a perfectly concise statement of a concept I've. held for years!

westerly1965 · October-14-10 10:10

I have heard that stat many times..from many different people many of them LEO'S. I tend to believe it is true.. That said I think it is very important to remember that true or untrue NOBODY ever WINS a fight...it just doesn't work and you certainly never win a gunfight. Best case scenario you survive and after a long drawn out court trial that probably sucks up every penny you have you walk away without your gun. Flight is always your best option...if its an option you can't take then draw your sidearm..but don't for a second think that just pulling it out is gonna make the bg go away. If your "in fear for your life" enough to pull your weapon then you better be ready to fire it...if your not leave it in your pocket you'll come out better. It's funny I had a female friend of mine the other day tell me how she had a 4" locking blade knife in her pocket for "self Defense" when I asked her if she had any formal training with it she said no I'll just pull it out and stab them if I need to LOL. When I informed her that she was most likely just giving her attacker another weapon she looked at me with a real blank look and stopped carrying the knife...

clipper1 · October-15-10 18:10

...Say Unc., There is a world of difference between whining and a statement of facts..

That said.. Westerly '65., I think the "Crimson Trace" ad. says it best; "The best gunfight, is the one You never have"...

jcoop1 · October-18-10 16:10

my dad always told me, never point a gun at anything or anyone you don't intend to shoot. I think this is good advice. hoping to scare a bg is gonna be a bad bet.

Is this a true statement?

sirbarkalot

moderndayidiot