Is 25 NAA ammo available?

[turrettooling]

I've tried Hornady, Corbon and many others and cannot find any ammo for the 25 NAA

I think both the 32 NAA and 25 NAA are the best pocket pistol calibers.

Is the 25 NAA failing to capture a market to sustain the product?

I'm new to the forum, but have been a NAA fan for many years.

Sincerely, Fred

[OV-1D]

  Welcome to the arena Turrettooling , when you can picture posting is a favorite around here .

[turrettooling]

Well, it looks like I'm just really late to the 25 NAA party.
I found a thread that was active about 8 years ago talking about this cool cartridge design.
I'd like to see more of this.

[heyjoe]

I've tried Hornady, Corbon and many others and cannot find any ammo for the 25 NAA

I think both the 32 NAA and 25 NAA are the best pocket pistol calibers.

Is the 25 NAA failing to capture a market to sustain the product?

I'm new to the forum, but have been a NAA fan for many years.

Sincerely, Fred

i would say right now the 25NAA is dead pending a resumption of manufacture of commercial ammo

[top dog]

Turret,
First welcome to the forum!!!

Do you reload??? If yes,you can probably form brass to make your cartridge.  Probably an e-mail to Hornaday or RCBS can get you the forming dies.

Try Midway USA to see about the ammo or maybe Graf & Sons out of Mexico,MO might have something.

I am sure that the stuff is out there.

I am sure that maybe other members of this forum can help as well.

                                                                                                                 Top Dog

[bearcatter]

I wonder, if owners of the 25 NAA and 32 NAA Guardians would prefer to quit scrounging for the caliber, can the guns be changed to the base caliber, 32 or 380 ACP? As best I can see, it would only involve re-barreling. I would think changing recoil springs, too; but by looking at the parts lists, no.

[turrettooling]

The thing is that the 25NAA is a significant development for mouse guns.
The 32ACP Guardian is one of the smallest, similar to the Secamp.
However, the 25 NAA cartridge is probably almost as effective as the 380!
This might give the 25 NAA guardian the best size to power ratio of any conventional firearm.
I found the dies for 25 NAA, and I have a Dillon Square Deal B

[mrmurl]

Turret; I work part time in a small gun shot near Pomme De Terre Lake in Missouri, and we keep 25 ACP ammo all the time.  Don't sell a lot but do sell some along.  I know that it is out there because we can get it regularly.  You will just have to call the shops in your area and ask.  Maybe one will special order you a few boxes at a time.  Not real predominate but it is available.

[heyjoe]

Turret; I work part time in a small gun shot near Pomme De Terre Lake in Missouri, and we keep 25 ACP ammo all the time.  Don't sell a lot but do sell some along.  I know that it is out there because we can get it regularly.  You will just have to call the shops in your area and ask.  Maybe one will special order you a few boxes at a time.  Not real predominate but it is available.

its 25NAA ammo not 25 ACP

[grayelky]

The 2 calibers do not have the following I think they deserve. It escapes my memory, but there was this discussion not too long ago where someone mentioned another company is picking up the NAA calibers. Someone will come along soon and share a link or the company's name.

I just ran across a Guardian in 32 NAA not very long ago. If I could find a Guardian in 25 NAA, I'd probably buy it.

[Dinadan]

I've tried Hornady, Corbon and many others and cannot find any ammo for the 25 NAA

I think both the 32 NAA and 25 NAA are the best pocket pistol calibers.

Is the 25 NAA failing to capture a market to sustain the product?

I'm new to the forum, but have been a NAA fan for many years.

Sincerely, Fred

Welcome to the forum, Turrettooling. I am not very knowledgeable about NAA pistols, but here are some numbers for NAA pistol production. Note that over a ten year period, from 2007 to 2016, NAA made only 153 .25 NAA pistols. Based on that number I think it is fair to say that NAA did fail to capture a market. Things could still change ...

[Canoeal]

Yes, but the .32 numbers are also misleading, because that includes 32 NAA and 32 ACP...
In this day and age it is very hard to get a new round, good as any may be, established. Look at the trouble a very good round, the 327 FM, has had getting respect. I tend to agree both the .25 NAA, and the .32 NAA are better than  their predecessors. Not sure the .25 was made a viable round though...I do think the .32 NAA is good. I think using the name might have slowed it down. Something like the .32 Super Auto might have attracted more attention. Marketing is a tough game. Both need more guns chambered for the round. JMHO

[bearcatter]

...... here are some numbers for NAA pistol production.

Where did you come across those numbers? I've even asked NAA directly for just some 'ballpark' numbers, and basically told they weren't available. Production normally tends to show the popularity, and survival, of a particular model; but these numbers are like a roller coaster. Especially the large drop after 2009. No wonder they're hard to find. The numbers make my 32 seem almost a "rare" gun, and don't fit their advertising the 32 as the most popular model. Mine is 2018 though, and those numbers aren't there. It's a AF prefix in the 6 thousands, but the 32 total up to 2016 is higher, so it's not clear what the serials indicate.

[Dinadan]

...... here are some numbers for NAA pistol production.

Where did you come across those numbers? I've even asked NAA directly for just some 'ballpark' numbers, and basically told they weren't available. Production normally tends to show the popularity, and survival, of a particular model; but these numbers are like a roller coaster. Especially the large drop after 2009. No wonder they're hard to find. The numbers make my 32 seem almost a "rare" gun, and don't fit their advertising the 32 as the most popular model. Mine is 2018 though, and those numbers aren't there. It's a AF prefix in the 6 thousands, but the 32 total up to 2016 is higher, so it's not clear what the serials indicate.

The numbers are from the ATF web page. Here is a link.


https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/data-statistics


The page is not super user friendly, but the data is there if you are willing to take a little time to figure out how ATF does things. They now have the 2017 numbers on the page. Below is a screen shot of the ATF page. Note that NAA made 50 .25 pistols in 2017. Below the pistol page is the ATF revolver page. Note that NAA made 46138 .22 revolvers in 2017.


Click on the images to enlarge.

[Rick_Jorgenson]

I know this isn't about the ammo but I was curious about the price's of these.

I found a couple on Gunbroker.com

25NAA Guardians

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/815555730

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/815596312

One is new $345.00
The other is used $250.00

[bearcatter]

The numbers are from the ATF web page. Here is a link.

https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/data-statistics   

Thanks for that, very much. A little disappointing, 17 thousand Guardians in eleven years; 46 thousand minis in one year.  More minis in one year than Guardians in their entire 22 year history. What is wrong with those numbers?  They are great pistols, but 1500 a year (averaged, most years a lot worse!) versus 46 K minis? Do Guardians need more promotion, more reviews? Higher production to get them in more gun shops and big boxes? I've never seen one outside the 32 I bought sight unseen. How many articles on pocket guns have I seen, that mention everything but Guardians, and the few that do it's the hot rod NAAs, or the 380.

[Canoeal]

Perhaps it is the marketplace not the guns. With the constant miniaturising  of the 380s in plastic, maybe there is just a small market for 13 oz. 32s and 16 oz.380s. Just a guess...

[bearcatter]

You may be right, but everyone that sees mine at the range wants to know what it is. Any mention at gun shop counters is the same. Even my favorite LGS didn't seem to know they exist. When I picked mine up from them, through Gallery Of Guns, the owner gave it a good look over, as he'd never seen one. They all seemed really impressed with it, and I'd guess I've caused a few sales.

When I decided to go to a small carry gun, it took a lot of Googling to get enough Guardian info to really make up my mind.

[Uncle_Lee]

I have given away 3 .25 NAA rounds to cartridge collectors because they couldn't find any.

[Dinadan]

I have given away 3 .25 NAA rounds to cartridge collectors because they couldn't find any.

That is a pretty sad statement about availability. I was a bit surprised that NAA was still making the .25 in 2017. Surely NAA must have some kind of deal with an ammunition maker to make the ammo since NAA is still making the pistols.

[miker]

I saw a thing about converting a 380 Browning 1910 to use 32NAA. Sounded like a great idea, unless you can't find the ammo.

[grayelky]

32 NAA is still available. 25 NAA is getting impossible to find.

I had a Beretta 84F (.380 ACP) in the shop for a good while. I searched diligently for a barrel for a Beretta 81 (I think. Same gun, only in 32 ACP). If I could have found a barrel, my Bride would now have a Beretta 84F in 32NAA. 13 rounds of 60 grain 32HP at roughly 1300-1350 FPS. I suspect the added weight of the Beretta would have reduced felt recoil noticeably! Fortunately, I finally sold the Beretta. If I were to run across a 32 ACP barrel......(for those who are not aware, all it takes is a chamber reamer, $80-$100, to make a 32 ACP barrel into a 32 NAA barrel. Then a simple barrel swap with a corresponding 380 ACP pistol, and you have a nice little pocket rocket of a self defense pistol.)

[RICKS PLACE]

While I have kept up with this thread, I remember I worked for a gun store when the .25 NAA came out out.  I thought it was a great round, but didn't think it wouldn't last. OK, the Guadians are still great, just worthless W/O ammo.  NAA made a lemon for sales.  I agree with Bearcat, shouldn't be a major undertaking to turn it into a .32 ACP.  Really wonder re the recoil springs? Send in the old barrel, re bore and rifle, should be a piece of cake.  Overall length of round ?, if no change, same magazine should work.  If enough present owners called/wrote NAA, they might find the company to do the work.  A few bucks would be worth getting your Guardian back in use.  Just saying....

[Canoeal]

They may already do that, for the few that ask...

[autofull]

well, years ago one was on the shelf at our private local gun shop. he sold it and the three boxes of ammo he had fer it. i phoned him yesterday but he claimed the guy never came back. musta been a happy one hit wonder buyer.  i tried fer ya guy. sorry,  kevin.

[heyjoe]

They may already do that, for the few that ask...

you never know till you ask.....good post!

[grayelky]

My guess is all it would take is a 32 ACP Guardian barrel. Mags should be the same. Recoil spring is likely to be the same.

[RICKS PLACE]

I think I am making a mistake.  I just looked at the parts list, seems the barrel is part of the frame so can't just changed barrels.  Guess my memory of the Guardians is as old as I am.  If I am reading it correctly, the only way would be to have the 25 NAA system is bored to a .32 caliber.  If I had a .25 NAA caliber weapon, I would call NAA, talk to one of their smiths re the feasibility of boring it to .32.  The parts list indicates the recoil springs to be the same for both calibers.  OK, I'm out of this thread.

[MR_22]

To the right person, a .25NAA Guardian is collector's gun. Shooting it maybe not be the point. To bore out a .25NAA barrel to fit a .32ACP cartridge just seems like a pointless thing to do to me. Guardians in .32ACP are so widely available, I'm not sure why anyone would do that, especially with the expense of what that would cost.

I have a couple hundred rounds for my .25NAA Guardian. I've only shot one magazine full so far. I'm not really expecting to shoot more anytime soon, but it's nice knowing that I can. (I posted a video of me shooting it. That's the only time I've shot it.)

For a reloader, it seems like a .25NAA would be a great collector's item.

[MR_22]

LOL, I just found a place where you can order Corbon .25NAA rounds--at $4.95 per round, with a max of 3 rounds.

https://www.shop.ammo-one1.com/25-NAA-North-America-Arms_c61.htm

[RangerJim]

LOL, I just found a place where you can order Corbon .25NAA rounds--at $4.95 per round, with a max of 3 rounds.

https://www.shop.ammo-one1.com/25-NAA-North-America-Arms_c61.htm

[OV-1D]

  I AGREE !!!! I just wonder where , I kinda know .

[Jessica Jarvis]

The 25 NAA is no longer being loaded by ANY commercial ammunition manufacturer, according to North American Arms. The only company that was loading it was CorBon, & they also confirmed that this ammunition is no longer in production.

I approved this message in case anyone is interested in purchasing. However, the first sentence is incorrect. NAA DOES currently have a vendor producing and providing the .25NAA ammo and will soon be doing the .32NAA.

[Jessica Jarvis]

True, CorBon is no longer making the ammo for us, but another supplier is and we currently have 50 gr. available and will continue to. FYI, I've been with company for 11 years running customer service and recently sales, I'm not just a moderator...