Ammo availability and you

[TwoGunJayne]

There must have been fifty thousand primers at one shop I checked today. By the 1,000 box and by the case... 1,000 primers were going for about $55.

Strange: No small pistol primers, just large. Magnum large pistol, small rifle, large rifle, large magnum rifle. I couldn't BELIEVE how many primers given that there's "all this shortage."
Projectiles: Not so much, an excellent wide selection... not so many of each kind. 600 9mm projectiles. Most other calibers were only 100-200 in stock each, but like 30 calibers. No brass at all. As far as primers go, the guy said "buy what you want." This may change, but not at the moment.

Pistol and shotgun powder, $19.50 a pound. Shotgun steel shot powder, same. Apparently, they just restocked. There were about 50 bottles of various rifle powder with no price on them.
12 boxes of .40 FMJ not counting hollowpoints, $34 each. Premium SD .40 was to be had. .380, $37/box. They actually had .22 mag, $19 a box. (Ouch.) Pretty much all rifle calibers were available, except .223/5.56. Even 7.62x39 was on the shelves. .308/7.62, all day. .45 acp and long colt were in. They even had .454 casull for my hand cannon, nobody locally has .460 S&W anymore. Strangely, they carry .500 S&W around here. .30-30, .243, .270, .30-06, .45-70... it was all in stock.

I even found some high cap butler creek and ram line 10/22 magazines for $29-$39, steel Ar-15 magazines, 30 rounds, $31.

No shot pellets.
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The thing I love about shotshell reloading is that you don't have to clean the hulls. I like that a lot.

[OV-1D]

  Where is u at dar TwoGun . Within driving range of anywhere ?  This just in take it for what it's worth well we all know that the feds are and were buying up all types of ammo nothing they use supposedly . I 've been talking to four gunsmiths , three don't even know the others , and their general opinion is that the feds are dumping that ammo in the ocean after receiving it . Could it be true backending the control of guns ? Also heard the feds are going to tax any future ammo so high practice will not be affordable or wise . Imports we already know are being stopped , just look at this new U.N. bull with importing and exporting , looks as though they are driving the gun manufacturers out of business . So keep your stash high and dry and under lock and key because before long ammo will be up there with gold prices . Plinking is going to become an issue , hope you have your sights and scopes zeroed in already .

[Kentucky Kevin]

speaking of reloading the 22lr, has anyone used one to start a fire. IE pulled the lead, dumped the powder and used the shell to ignite the powder??

[TwoGunJayne]

I saw a guy named Les Stroud use that trick on his survival show. He had a hard time making it work and wasn't afraid to show his failures.

[bigwheel]

Hmmm no..never woulda thought of that one. I used to know this kid who pulled the bullets and smashed the cases between two rocks to hear them pop. That's bizarre huh?

[OV-1D]

  I wonder WHO ? Glad he had the good sense to pull the load out first .

[Kentucky Kevin]

Well, #! is lighter, #2 is magnifying glass in billfold, #3 is not tested. Interesting, while we were having this conversation, my boys were trying to use thier magnesium/flint kits to make a flame. My wife/girlfriend, God bless her heart, got them some lint from the dryer to use.

[I]

209 primers make great slingshot ammo. Shoot them at rocks or solid walls. 

[RogueTS1]

$55.00 per 1000 primers is twice the usual price. That is the going price at the one place here I can get them. The pistol powder price looks about normal though.

$27.00 per 1000 is normal price for CCI primers.

[I]

High demand items are getting gouged. Let the seller sit on them until they rot.

This worked to the particular store's disadvantage. The last time there was a magazine scare, I picked up 33 round glock magazines for $25 because they didn't care. They didn't even bother to restock them.

Maybe in 5 years they will get sick of sitting on half a million primers in the back room and mark them down. You cant have 30 something calibers of projectiles on the shelves and only 1 or 2 boxes in stock. It just doesn't work that way.

Let the sellers get hungry. It might not take even 6 months, but the local fools might require a couple of years to get the point... even if ammo and everything came back in tomorrow.

I noticed someone buying a box of .22 mag and rather than let the guy have a box from the pile, the shop guy pulled out something from a shelf and handed it to the buyer.

Sad. So *** sad. A gouger at work.

[MR_22]

I agree I.

Gouging is going on everywhere, including here. I ain't buying any right now (and when I say I, I mean me, not I--which is you). I (or me) was prepared before the disaster. I had plenty of oil for my lamp before the bridegroom came. I've shot up a little bit of my ammo, but not tons, but I'll wait out the storm and buy more when the price suddenly drops from too much supply.

I think the prices will remain high until after summer, though.

[RogueTS1]

As long as they go down before the weather gets too cold again. I would like to have the supplies to do some inside activities (reloading) once summer is over.

[PJ Garrison]

What's all this talk about gouging?  Didn't anybody take economics in high school? 

"Gouging" is a term coined by the ignorant who insist that prices stay conveniently low, despite the ever-changing market conditions that dictate otherwise.  Those sellers who keep prices at pre-demand levels will find their shelves picked clean and may well find themselves out of business with no product to sell and not enough money to restock.

We're dealing with a shortage, caused by demand being at at all time high.  Replacement costs have gone up, and getting new stock is uncertain.  The smart thing for sellers to do is to raise prices to reflect the scarcity of the supply.  This is not about gouging, it's about staying in business in a volatile market.

Yes it sucks that prices are high right now.  As consumers, you've just got to put on your big-boy (or big-girl) pants and ride it out.  The good news is that capitalism is extremely good at rectifying supply and demand issues.  Ammo manufacturers will increase supply, and new resources will be tapped to meet the demand.

Of course if the gouger-grumpers had their way we'd have a soviet-style command economy with fixed prices, no choice, constant shortages, and inferior product.

[.54Cal_Kidd]

Anyone remember Russians standing in line in a snow storm waiting hours for ice cream? Or TP?

[PJ Garrison]

As far as my neck of the woods goes, I stopped at the local gun store about three weeks ago (as well as Wall Mart and Big 5) looking for ammo.

Handgun ammo was unavailable in any popular or semi-popular caliber.  The same was true of most rifle calibers.  .22 LR (CCI Blazer) was only available at the LGS for $10 per 50-round box (limit 2 per customer).  My brother paid $20 for 100 rounds of  ammo.  Yikes!

Gun-wise, there were no automatic pistols at all, and only a few revolvers in odd calibers (or single actions).  There were no semi-automatic rifles (except for a few oddball .22s).  Shotguns and a small selection of wood-stocked hunting rifles were the only things that could be had in and real quantity.

I've never seen that store so bare, but after talking with them they basically told me that they couldn't get enough product in to meet the demand.

[bigwheel]

Got to highly admire anybody who managed to stay awake during Economics 101. Unfortunately we have some forces at work which are not factored into the old free market equations.  What we have here is an exotic and highly government regulated commodity (ammunition) which is controlled by commie socialists in the government and his co-conspirators in private industry..the commodities market..bureaucratic agencies etc...which about half the population is sympathetic to their evil schemes. It aint a purty scenario. I would not waste any bullets on target practice or having fun. 

[OV-1D]

  When this shi*head president starts coming to the end of his second term he'll say to everyone he was kidding about all the gun control and everyone will rejoice and vote him in for a third term . RIIGGGHHHTTTT ! He'll even repeal his own obamacare just to gain favor . Wouldn't that be the pip maybe even turn Catholic ..

[bigwheel]

Don't think the Holy Sacrament of Liberalism i.e. Abortion..would set too well with the Catholics..course gay marriage did not seem to set well with them either up until the new Pope came of board..and now its just fine..so who knows? You may be on to something here.

[OV-1D]

  Sorry TwoGun I'm drifting again . I know I'm bad about this . Everyone I apologize for now and for the future .

[bigwheel]

You being a bad boy? lol I'm trying to decide how many more .22 LR we might need. Is there any fast rule of thumb about that? I should have listened to Glen B. when he said start stocking up a year or two back..or his predecessor about 30 years previous named Howard Ruff.."How to Survive the Coming Ruff Times" very good book for them who aint read it. He predicted boxes of .22 shells would make a great barter item when the commies are able to collapse the economy.  Now Glenn say stock up on hundred watt light bulbs too. Who has those? Thanks.

[I]

Gouging is when you have a shelf full of product marked at twice the price or higher.

You marked it up because of "market forces?" That's gouging.

The problem is when you do it with food and water, people have to have those things "or else."

1,000 pounds of ammo on the shelves, let's just double the price. "There's a shortage."

[bigwheel]

Let us pretend the evil bullets are tobacco products. How to make folks quit buying is easy..raise the price to astronomical levels..tax it to death..interrupt the supply chain (how do you speel George Sorros?)..over regulate it to death..use the military budget to hawg up billions of rounds for guv'ment use (to kills us supposedly)..shred the military used brass and sell it to the Chicoms instead as was previously done of selling it to domestic cartridge makers.  It smells a lot like a commie plot to me.  They say..keep all them purty guns..just give us the bullets. Them folks are dumb and stupid but they are cunning like a chicken killing fox in an effort to realize their agenda. Liberals are a lot like muslims in case nobody has noticed. Lying..cheating..stealing and murder are just fine as long as it advances the cause of world wide socialism/caliphates etc.

[I]

Hold on. The problem with Muslims is when they take an extremist view of their book, particularly the part that says, "kill the infidel."

The infidel doesn't mean YOU OR ME, unless you're one of those that insists you're an infidel... thinking you're peeing on their religion.

An "infidel," according to the Muslims, is simply one who is against God. Their book says to kill them. The New Testament says to "turn the other cheek," but don't forget that the Old Testament said "an eye for an eye."

It's kind of like the modern militant Muslim has only read the Old Testament and has never heard of the love and sacrifice of Jesus Christ. Basically.

The "good" parts of Christianity and Islam are similar. It's when people get down to the nit picking details and decide to kill each other over them is when you get one of the biggest religious and political problems facing the world today... and for the past couple of thousand years at least.

When people say Muhammed killed people who simply insulted him, so treat others that way... they're not thinking. They're doing what some book said someone else did.

Moderate modern Muslims aren't going to strap a b*mb to their chests.

It's the idiots who did something stupid that get into the news. It's always the biggest idiot they can find that they quote on the evening news. It's always the worst of the worst radical militant Muslims that get on the news for being captured or killed for trying to propagate a campaign to murder the innocent.

The innocent are not infidels. The innocent should go to sunday school. Osama Bin Laden was an infidel. When he was killed, no country would accept his body... not even his "home" country. His own people regarded him as an infidel for what he had done with his life.
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Tobacco is not bullets, but they are closely related. Tobacco leaves are engraved on our money and in the sculpture of our governmental buildings. The proceeds from the tobacco industry helped to build this country. You could say that bullets did, as well. They are both ingrained into our society.

The anti-gunners say, "well, we don't need that any more." The English thought the same thing when they destroyed their own gun culture and industry before WW2. I'm sure the Germans were most grateful for an entire unarmed country in their crosshairs. It was only the English Channel that saved them from the initial fate that befell France.

Those who don't learn history are doomed to repeat it. We cannot and will not ban guns in the United States. It goes against everything upon which we were founded, our history, our customs, and our way.

Food for thought: Freedom of Religion is on the same list as "...the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed." We can't ban Islam, but we can legally prosecute and pursue those who would harm the innocent. I guess we'll need guns to do that since the bad guys will already have them.

Freedom to smoke tobacco while shooting firearms (even though that can contribute to lead poisoning) is a sign... a barometer that we are free to do as we please. This sounds more like the way the Founding Fathers wanted it to be rather than Obama robbing me to give my money to fraudulent Welfare claims while I am starving with holes in my clothes.

I have some clothes with holes in them, you know. I wear them when doing dirty work. You know, what the elite of this country don't understand. It doesn't mean I should pay for your 12 illegitimate children because 4 bastards weren't getting you large enough of a government check.

See the movie Idiocracy. It's where we're headed.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0387808/

Now combine this with 1984. Welcome to America, 2084 AD.

[bigwheel]

What most do not understand about the Koran is the real nasty parts come late in the book...after the nicey nicey parts which they stole off the Old Testament..and the nasty stuff supersedes the good precursors by all rational interpretation of what it says..and in the direct words of whats his face. The goal of them all is a world wide Caliphate under Sharia Law. They vary the routine to achieve the goal depending on what they think will work best. Since their domestic birth rates outnumber us 7 to 1...the smart money would be for them to out copulate us and do the Sharia thing through the ballot box. Take a look at France and Jolly Olde England sometime. They are infested to the gills. We have a Muslim president..and most likely head of the CIA. They are making good progress here too. They are the same as liberals.

http://www.salon.com/2013/02/10/john_brennan_is_a_secret_muslim_says_anti_islam_activist/

[I]

The Koran, like the Bible is full of stuff that can be quoted to support virtually anything you're trying to do.

Old testament has quite a bit of "kill 'em all." Armies of God, that sort of thing.

While a religious leader had his arms raised, his army won the battle so some kid helped keep his arms in the air. The problem with that, is I believe that statement to be metaphorical... that the children of a Godly man would take up the path of God and hopefully not be wicked. Sounds good, right?

The problem is when some people literally think that if their pastor/minister/whatever literally has his arms stuck into the air that evil can never triumph. This is the problem you get when you try an 100% literal interpretation of a religious book. If this were in the Koran, the militant Islam would say that any holy man without his arms stuck up into the air is allowing evil to triumph, therefore an infidel, and now we have people murdering someone who was trying to convey religion to interested people. Maybe the religious leader wasn't even militant, maybe he was a guy saying "hey, don't kill everyone. Be smart about this. The infidel vanishes through education, through learning, through wisdom. Perhaps an infidel is actually your mother, your brother, but you lacked wisdom to see that they were your deepest family and had done no wrong."

...or something like that.

We've been killing each other for many centuries. I hope the dumba*sses don't win.

I like how Australia basically said "We're not doing Sharia. Shut it or leave." Except for their gun laws, I kind of like what I've heard about OZ.

[bigwheel]

You are a mighty cornfused young heathern..lol. Got buy yourself a plain old Engrish Version of the Bible...I like the one called "The Book"..takes all the hithertos and ripping asunders out of it. Read it from Romans to the end and start over and read if from Genesis to Revelation..plus look at the maps. Claim the promises you find and pretend they are true. They will be. That is about the best way I know how to explain it to the Prodigal Son..lol. Takes a little bit faith to get Saved. Where do faith come from some might ask? It comes from the Word. No need to pray for it. Takes some reading and listening. The more you hear the more it will make sense. Then Whamo. You become a Child of God. Isn't that neat?  Since you are getting the Old Testament and the New Covenant mixed up remember this is the demarcation line between the two narratives.

John 19:30
When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Total new ball game at that point. Dontcha see?

[G50AE]

I'd like a music box pocket watch, and a pair of those Sabata pistols as well.

Actually I have been eyeing a set up like this, http://www.pocketwatchcentral.com/pocket-watch-chains/cdavc-pp-classique-palladium-plated-double-albert-vest-chain/

A double Albert style vest chain worn with a waistcoat.  On the right side I'll have a watch, the left side a Sidewinder.  Now if you notice that little pendant chain in the middle, I am going to hang a replica of the Trillion Dollar Coin.  Hopefully the Trillion Dollar Coin will not have the face of Barack Hussein Obama on it. 

[bigwheel]

Wow looks like that come right out of Gentleman's Quarterly. What is Palladium? Aint that radioactive or something?  Its good for cold fusion think I heard on TV one time.

[RogueTS1]

Palladium is a high noble metal in the Platinum family. It is the most precious metal; more so than Platinum, Gold or Silver.

Very nice piece in regards to the pocket chain.

[bigwheel]

Thanks for the tutorial on Palladium. I am currently going through an old Sears Catalog looking for waist coats. Any suggestion on those?  Do a person need just one or several and what colors? Do it have to match the cummerbund?  What kinda shoes etc? I'm getting excited about this.

[Kentucky Kevin]

So if I invest my lead and brass wisely, and sell at replacement cost, I'm an entrepenuer and not an EVIL gouger. I did not know there was a shortage untill I read it here. Thanks be unto God, or is that thanketh beth untoeth God /

[boone123]

G50AE
I have some chains like that that I got through Ebay from England that are all heavy sterling silver. Most with graduated links.
\Also have some old pocket watches. At one time I looked at looked at hooking a watch on one end and a mini on the other.
Just didn't have the cloths that were compatable to the plan. Also thought how neat it would look if the little chain in the middle had a 22 short mini hanging on it.
The oldest watch I have is a 19 size key wind,hunter case,  coin silver, made in 1869. I think it weighs more than a 22 short.
I had a period in my life when I was self employed , I wore bib overhalls with a pocket watch on a chain it the top bib pocket. Chain had a thing hanging on it, but not a mini. If I could find bibs that fit instead of the baggy things  they sell I would do it again sometimes just for the comfort and the watch and chain thing.

[Dinadan]

I like the double Albert chain myself. Don't have one - I wear my watch in the pocket of a western style vest with the chain up to a button hole, I just think a double Albert would be too dressy for my kind of vest. Still, I would like to put a Short on the other end of a double Albert.

[Kevin]

bigwheel, try some cowboy action outfitters for some stylish vests, such as River Junction http://www.riverjunction.com/ , Wild West Merchantile http://www.wwmerc.com/ or Scully Leather http://www.scullyleather.com/ .

[G50AE]

Thanks for the tutorial on Palladium. I am currently going through an old Sears Catalog looking for waist coats. Any suggestion on those?  Do a person need just one or several and what colors? Do it have to match the cummerbund?  What kinda shoes etc? I'm getting excited about this.

Palladium is the most noble of metals because of the way that electron energy levels overlap, the element effectively has no valance electrons and thus cannot react with anything.

A waistcoat (vest) is not worn with a cumberbund, it is worn in place on one and is considered the more formal accessory.  Typically the waistcoat will either match with the suit jacket and pants which is the set up for a three piece suit, or will match the tie in a formal setup.

White tie is considered to be more formal that black tie, so I think a white waistcoat, black waistcoat, and any other color to match your suit jackets would be the way to go for starters.  If you are of Irish descent, or a graduate of the University of Missouri at Rolla, you may want a green tie and waistcoat for St. Pat's day.  If you are of Scotish descent a plaid waistcoat of whatever plaid your clan wore would be just the ticket on Bob Burns' birthday.  Those of Italian descent might want a red white and green themed waistcoat for Columbus Day.

Look sharp, carry always, and keep your powder dry.