Finally took my sidewinder to the range

[dbgUSMC]

Ok so I am very new here to the forums. The first and only NAA pistol that I have is the 22mag cylinder only sidewinder. I took it to the range and put a little over 50 rounds through it. I had a lot of fun with it, but there were some issues I had that were mainly with extracting the rounds. I couldn't aim well, but that was just me. I have some questions about the cylinder and if this is normal or not. There were a couple of times when I was trying to extract the rounds and the cylinder actually went back past the point I think it should go. Does the cylinder normally go this far back or is this abnormal and I need to have NAA look at it for me? Sorry if this has already been addressed.

I was changing it up between two types of Hornady rounds.
1) Critical Defense  45GR - These were very hard to extract! I actually had to knock the extractor against a table to get the rounds out. Kind of made me not like the round.
2) 30 Gr. - These shot fine and extracted fine. There was a noticeable difference of less kick versus the 45GR rounds.






Video of me shooting 5 rounds if anyone wants to see. I wasn't very accurate with it, but hey it's my first time out with this size pistol. I will learn.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOM6y4jNWXM&list=UUbxAtrUdoZ1xmvr11ptE3yw&index=1 

[cedarview kid]

Are you sighting along the top of the flat barrel? Sometimes people tend to dip the front end so they see just the top of the sight, which is not the correct sight picture. You should place the front sight over your target and sight down the flat top of the barrel. If that's not what you were doing, try it again next time and see if accuracy improve.

If that's what you WERE, doing... then never mind!

But in any case, grats on your your Sidewinder! Looks like a good shooter!

[harkamsu]

That's definitely not normal. Send it to NAA to get looked at. The cylinder should not go past the blast shields. Check this video. You'll see Jeff demonstrating the extractor. You'll see that the cylinder does not go anywhere near as far back as yours.

Here's the clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Zhr88F0J40&t=0m40s

[grayelky]

I have not fired any of my Sidewinders, but that seems a little too much movement. I would suggest you email pics to customer service at NAA and let them offer suggestions.

I have not had any extraction issues with the Hornady CD rounds, but then I have only fired them in the standard minis and the Earl. It is my preferred carry ammo. Typically, lighter bullet weight will produce less felt recoil, hence the 30 gr having less recoil.

[dbgUSMC]

The cylinder doesn't seem to go back past the blast shield when I just push on the extractor rod. Though if im having trouble extracting the rounds and grab the cylinder too that's when there's movement of the cylinder.

So basically if I open up my sidewinder and grab the cylinder and pull backwards it ends up looking like the photos above.

[Dinadan]

dbgUSMC - it appears that the cylinder on your Sidewinder is swinging out just a millimeter too far. With my Sidewinder the cylinder is kept from sliding back by the overlap between the cylinder and the recoil shield. As you can see in the photos, the overlap is minimal.

Just read you last post - make sure your cylinder screw is snug - sounds like there is a little play which a loose screw could allow.

[dbgUSMC]

I tried tightening the screw as tight as humanly possible, but it still seems like my cylinder just comes too far out. I tried to get some good pictures of what it looks like when mine is open. It's basically right at the edge of the blast shield. So when it does fall backwards towards the grips it does rub against the blast shield, but it still doesn't prevent it from coming backwards.

Here are some images of it open.

[bigwheel]

Few things you might consider. First is there is no way for a normal person to get an accurate sight picture on them little cuties till you get some handle extensions so you get a chance to see the sights. Hard to get out cases is a sign of too much pressure. Do not target practice with the bad boys which swelled up. Figger out where they are hitting and save them in the gun for bizness purposes. The extractor riding up over the top of the hulls is normally a clue to limp wristed type ejecting procedures..is on most similar revolvers anyway. When you want to shuck point the base of the hulls straight down 90 degrees and whop the ejector rod sharply with the palm of the other hand.  Think that will cure that problem. Order some wobbly floppers to be able to see the sights. Hope this helps.

[dbgUSMC]

Few things you might consider. First is there is no way for a normal person to get an accurate sight picture on them little cuties till you get some handle extensions so you get a chance to see the sights. Hard to get out cases is a sign of too much pressure. Do not target practice with the bad boys which swelled up. Figger out where they are hitting and save them in the gun for bizness purposes. The extractor riding up over the top of the hulls is normally a clue to limp wristed type ejecting procedures..is on most similar revolvers anyway. When you want to shuck point the base of the hulls straight down 90 degrees and whop the ejector rod sharply with the palm of the other hand.  Think that will cure that problem. Order some wobbly floppers to be able to see the sights. Hope this helps.

Sorry I am not trying to be rude, but I do not think I fully understand what you mean...

[bigwheel]

Well I thought you said you couldnt see the sights on the little gun very well..thats why you need the handle extensions. Then I thought you said you said spent brass that did not want to come out of the cylinder. That was about not shooting the hot bullets for target practice but save them for if you ever need to shoot a bad guy. Then I thought I heard you say you had managed to make the ejector plate get up on top of some of the empties. Thats why I gave the tip on effective ejection procedures. Now if you didnt say all that I take all this back of course. Let me know. Thanks. Maybe I replied to the wrong message or something. I aint very compooter literate.

[dbgUSMC]

Well I thought you said you couldnt see the sights on the little gun very well..thats why you need the handle extensions. Then I thought you said you said spent brass that did not want to come out of the cylinder. That was about not shooting the hot bullets for target practice but save them for if you ever need to shoot a bad guy. Then I thought I heard you say you had managed to make the ejector plate get up on top of some of the empties. Thats why I gave the tip on effective ejection procedures. Now if you didnt say all that I take all this back of course. Let me know. Thanks. Maybe I replied to the wrong message or something. I aint very compooter literate.

No, I think you replied to the correct post. I just wasn't understanding what you meant. I didn't say I couldn't see the sights just that I couldn't aim well. I just have to figure out how to align the sight picture properly for this pistol that's all. Are you saying get some bigger grips? Just going to take some time for me to get used to this gun.

It's not the extractor that is going over the empty casings it's the whole cylinder moving back past the blast shield. The extractor works fine with the 30 GR rounds, but I have to really hit it hard to extract the 45 GR criticial defense rounds. Like Dinadan said I think that my cylinder just simply swings too far out when unloading / reloading. When it's out that far it can allow the cylinder to be pushed back past the blast shield like the pictures in the first post. Thanks.

[bigwheel]

Yes I was going to recommend bigger grips but since you already got your mind made up not to get any..I won't mention that..lol. Gotcha on the cylinder pogo action. Never had one do that. Best of fortunes on it. NAA customer service has been astounding so far. Betcha they can fix it. Swelled up and sticking cases are a sign of high pressure. I would not shoot the fancy loads for much target practice. It aint good for your gun.

[TwoGunJayne]

The Hornady .22 mag Critical Defense rounds work in my minis, the Sidewinder should be no exception. When I've had a new mini in the past with ejection problems, either I wasn't using suggested ammo (Hornady CD is FINE) or there was a problem with the bore of my cylinder chambers. The only problem that I've ever heard with Hornady CD is the occasional failure to fire in the first production runs when they came online, not stuck cases.

NAA customer service is 100% on point. Give them a call, have patience and it WILL be sorted out. NAAs are a lifetime kind of thing. None of this "disposable junk." This is the kind of stuff you give your kids later. Take a breath, don't get frustrated, and call them before you send it in.

[boone123]

NAA pays shipping back to the factory for two years after it was made. So as Jayne says, call them.

[dbgUSMC]

Oh I'm definitely not frustrated just wanted to know if these things were normal. I have sent an email to their customer service to see what they suggest for me to do. I still love this little gun even with the few small issues I'm having. If I have to send it in for repair it will be an excuse for my to purchase the LR cylinder for it while it's there, lol.

[Kentucky Kevin]

dgbUSMC thanks for serving and welcome to mini world. They are accurate, if you'll take the time to practice

[prplhays]

I took a quick look at my SW and my cylinder comes down about as far as you show in your pictures, but the cylinder seems to be fixed to the ejector rod and the cylinder will not go back beyond the blast shield edge even though it will barely clear the edge. I've only fired 15 rounds of of Winchester Super-X 40 grain solid point and had no extraction problems.

[RogueTS1]

1) Critical Defense  45GR - These were very hard to extract! I actually had to knock the extractor against a table to get the rounds out. Kind of made me not like the round.

It is not recommended to use such force to get stuck casings out of these small revolvers. If they will not come out with hand pressure then it is recommended to do like the other NAA minis and poke them out with a pin. That much pressure on the ejector rod is likely to damage it.

[dbgUSMC]

1) Critical Defense  45GR - These were very hard to extract! I actually had to knock the extractor against a table to get the rounds out. Kind of made me not like the round.

It is not recommended to use such force to get stuck casings out of these small revolvers. If they will not come out with hand pressure then it is recommended to do like the other NAA minis and poke them out with a pin. That much pressure on the ejector rod is likely to damage it.

Good to know I will try that in the future. I will just have to find some kind of pin that will work that doing that. Thanks though.

I have already gotten a response from NAA customer service. They were very fast at responding to my email inquiry about the cylinder going back past the blast shield. They informed me that this is not normal for the cylinder to do this. So they gave me the FedEx account number for me to send it back to them for repair. It should take about two weeks, but I was told it could be sooner (they would try as fast as possible). I am in no real big hurry so that works for me. So since I have to send it in I told them I wanted to go ahead and have the LR cylinder purchased as well. So in a way this works out for me in the end since I wasn't able to purchase a sidewinder with the conversion cylinder to begin with  .

[dbgUSMC]

dgbUSMC thanks for serving and welcome to mini world. They are accurate, if you'll take the time to practice

Thank you for the support. It was my pleasure serving this great country!

[bigwheel]

Dittos to what Hardtack said. Thanks for your Service to Our Country Sir! While that gun is in their hands have em mount some wobbly floppers on it. That will make it to where you can hit stuff..lol.

[dbgUSMC]

Thanks! I assume by wobbly floppers you're talking about the holster grips? Lol. I have considered ordering those, but wasn't sure they worked with the sidewinders.

[bigwheel]

Hmmm not sure about that non compatible theory. From the pics it looks about the same size and shape as my plain jane model which is now proudly equipped with the holster grips? Sure somebody who knows whats whut will speak up shortly...hopefully. If not give NAA a call at the toll free number. They will tell you all about it and then some most likely.  You can use em for a while and take em off if you dont like em. If they got some to fit your gun of course.

[Dinadan]

dbgUSMC - glad to read that NAA is going to take care of you so quickly. I think  getting the LR cylinder is a good idea, too.

1) Critical Defense  45GR - These were very hard to extract! I actually had to knock the extractor against a table to get the rounds out. Kind of made me not like the round.

It is not recommended to use such force to get stuck casings out of these small revolvers. If they will not come out with hand pressure then it is recommended to do like the other NAA minis and poke them out with a pin. That much pressure on the ejector rod is likely to damage it.

I am a little concerned about applying too much force to the crane as well. I hold the cylinder between thumb and middle finger when I extract. I have not had any rounds that jammed. Aguila Supercolibri was a bit harder to extract than anything else I have used. I think they may have thinner cases than most.

[bigwheel]

Dang you a hard headed Jyrene..lol. Dont shoot the super dooper bullets and you won't have these issues. Stuck cases makes me real nervous and I ain't anal about safe gun procedures. Find the hottest they got that dont stick. There ya go. Semper Fi..uh rah.

[TwoGunJayne]

Weird, the only Aguila I've had stick in an NAA is their "super high velocity" stuff. I quit using it in minis. I got out a mike and compared brass thickness. Yeah, it's thinner than CCI.

That blows my mind that supercolibri low velocity ammo would cause stuck brass. It runs fine through my minis. They must have used the thinnest of their thin brass for that batch.

[bigwheel]

Same here Jayne. It feels funny to call a guy by that name..lol. I thought he was talking about some kinda hyper-velocity stuff which was getting stuck..did not know the culprit was slow pokey. Drawing upon my vast store of physics and looking for the slide rule that is real easy. The bullets are clearing the case more slowly and allowing more efficient use of the powder and causing pressures to rise. Simple huh? Why would anybody want a bullet like that? They claim in other posts the little minis cant break the sound barrier even with yellow jackets and mini mags. Only excuse I ever heard for a slow poke bullets is to allow the mafia to use silencers. Correct my thinking here. Thanks. 

[Dinadan]

In my SidewinderI have shot three kinds of mags, CCI Maximags, CCI/Speer Gold-dots, Winchester SuperX: and CCI Minimags and Remington Target LR, and CCI Target and Subsonic Shorts. I know it seems strange, but in my Sidewinder the Aguila Supercolibri is the hardest to extract. I have shot it in some of my other Minis and not noticed anything. Probably because in the other Minis I am extracting one round at a time whereas with the Sidewinder I am freeing five at a time.

I like plinking with shorts and Supercolibri because they are not as noisy as LR or mags. I usually use shorts, but I wanted to try the Colibri. They are not really quiet in a Mini, but then, nothing is!

[bigwheel]

Good points. Not seeing much use in tryng to quiet the noisy biotch..lol. Also on trying to drag out five at once.. got to be a different ball game than poking them out one at time with the poker gizmo. Not sure they still make Winchester Wildcats but just happen to have half a box marked Grocery and cost 1.99. They seem to have a solid lead bullet an purty well guaranteed to stay sub sonic if the temps right. They was a favorite of the biker gangs to do hits with their silenced Ruger semi auto pistols. Not worth a caca for frog hunting in a rifle.

[TwoGunJayne]

..did not know the culprit was slow pokey. Why would anybody want a bullet like that? They claim in other posts the little minis cant break the sound barrier even with yellow jackets and mini mags. Only excuse I ever heard for a slow poke bullets is to allow the mafia to use silencers. Correct my thinking here. Thanks.

The powederless "cap" rounds (CCI CB caps, Aguila Colibri and Supercolibri, etc) are super quiet out of a bolt action .22 rifle. It's sort of like turning it into a quiet small game pellet rifle without a can and without paperwork. They seem pretty much just as loud as high velocity short out of a short-only mini. 20 grain .22 at 700-800 fps is fine for small game, and is actually more powerful than most pellet rifles. My Minimaster very nearly goes supersonic over a chronograph with some rounds. I think my Hogleg actually DOES go supersonic with some loads; I haven't chronoed it, but I hear the "crack" when shooting the hot stuff. I don't think there's a way to use factory ammo and go supersonic in anything shorter. Supersonic tends to be less accurate, anyway. No big deal.

I know it seems strange, but in my Sidewinder the Aguila Supercolibri is the hardest to extract. I have shot it in some of my other Minis and not noticed anything. Probably because in the other Minis I am extracting one round at a time whereas with the Sidewinder I am freeing five at a time.
I like plinking with shorts and Supercolibri because they are not as noisy as LR or mags. I usually use shorts, but I wanted to try the Colibri. They are not really quiet in a Mini, but then, nothing is!

Weird. You probably don't want to bother with Aguila high velocity shorts, then. I've had bad luck with them in any mini I've tried. I quit buying them as most of my rimfire shooting is NAA.

Good points. Not seeing much use in tryng to quiet the noisy biotch..lol. Also on trying to drag out five at once.. got to be a different ball game than poking them out one at time with the poker gizmo. Not sure they still make Winchester Wildcats but just happen to have half a box marked Grocery and cost 1.99. They seem to have a solid lead bullet an purty well guaranteed to stay sub sonic if the temps right. They was a favorite of the biker gangs to do hits with their silenced Ruger semi auto pistols. Not worth a caca for frog hunting in a rifle.

Yeah, Winchester still makes Wildcats if you can find them. They're alright, I guess. I picked up a 2,000 round bulk bag a few years ago and forgot about it in a storage room. I just found them the other day and I'm bound and determined to run them all through my minis. I'm still working on it. Pow, pow, pow! I've got "spending ammo!"

[bigwheel]

Well you are indeed a wise and fortunate young fellow to have all those .22 bullets. The Wildcats shoot high in my mini guessing because they are going slower than some. The Wildcats will come in handy if you want to grow up to be a hit man...lol.

[.54Cal_Kidd]

I have a 20 year old brick of Wildcat. The price tag says $11.99    And I have no idea what Don's Guns and Ammo I got it from.  Any idea what the shelf life is?

[Dinadan]

I do not know about the Wildcat. I have shot Winchester and Remington that was more than 25 years old and it shot okay.

[ikoiko]

If you have enough newer ammo, I'd say it's time to experiment. Honest to goodness empirical data.

[bigwheel]

Dang Kidd..sounds like we'uns is in a slightly similar dilemma. My mini got to be 30 years old at least..and the bullets is older than that..humm. They shot fine the last time I shot one about 20 years ago or so. I aint got many bullets for it and not sure where to get some more..so dont want to risk shooting it. Sides we live in town..somebody prob call the cops etc. lol..I bet they will still be good. An inebriated pal and myself decided to shoot his grandpappys .38-40 januine yellow boy carbine with the original ammo one dark night. It worked fine..knocked a big old limb off the mesquite tree. The whole shebang was a hundred plus years old and not particularly well stored. Under the bed? They bound to make ammo with longer shelf life than that nowadays.