YES, I DO CARRY A NAA .22WMR REVOLVER FOR DEDICATED SELF-DEFENSE

[PRM]

I grew up in the rural South and every farmer I knew had a .22 pistol or rifle in their pick-up.  We shot everything that needed shooting with them.  Coyotes, feral dogs, hogs at killing time... didn't matter. I hear folks complaining about the .22 rim fire being unreliable.  Can't say that has been my experience either.  I've had just as many bad primers as bad rim fires.  Internet legends are hard to die, and a lot of folks spend more time on the key board than they do the range.  I'm just as comfortable with my .22s as any other caliber.  I also don't expect  a one shot stop with any caliber - it's all about shot placement.  My 2 cents.   

[TwoGunJayne]

Internet legends are hard to die, and a lot of folks spend more time on the key board than they do the range.

Quoted for truth! Mike Bellm says the exact same thing on the T&C contender/encore single shot shooting list. He's got a great site, btw.

[nastruck]

My 2 cents!!!!
Is the mini, any mini considered a deadly weapon? I believe so!!!!
nough said

[Bigbird48]

  22 assassins weapon of choice

[Goatpacker]

I grew up in the rural South and every farmer I knew had a .22 pistol or rifle in their pick-up.  We shot everything that needed shooting with them.  Coyotes, feral dogs, hogs at killing time... didn't matter. I hear folks complaining about the .22 rim fire being unreliable.  Can't say that has been my experience either.  I've had just as many bad primers as bad rim fires.  Internet legends are hard to die, and a lot of folks spend more time on the key board than they do the range.  I'm just as comfortable with my .22s as any other caliber.  I also don't expect  a one shot stop with any caliber - it's all about shot placement.  My 2 cents.   

This guy is right on!!! I'll throw my 2 cents on top of PRM's and that makes 4 cents!!! Right On!!!

[Uncle_Lee]

I grew up in the rural South and every farmer I knew had a .22 pistol or rifle in their pick-up.  We shot everything that needed shooting with them.  Coyotes, feral dogs, hogs at killing time... didn't matter. I hear folks complaining about the .22 rim fire being unreliable.  Can't say that has been my experience either.  I've had just as many bad primers as bad rim fires.  Internet legends are hard to die, and a lot of folks spend more time on the key board than they do the range.  I'm just as comfortable with my .22s as any other caliber. I also don't expect  a one shot stop with any caliber - it's all about shot placement.   My 2 cents.   

This guy is right on!!! I'll throw my 2 cents on top of PRM's and that makes 4 cents!!! Right On!!!

I'll kick in a penny, that makes it a nickel.

I don't care what you are shooting, it is ALL in shot placement.

My dad and I did a lot of custom butchering. We killed a lot of big steers and hogs with 22 LR solids.

[OV-1D]

 Exactly Unc .

[G50AE]

That would make a good song.

The song is entitled "Carry on my Wayward Son" by Kansas. 

[Kentucky Kevin]

GUN CONTROL IS A BEAUTIFUL THING, Ask the Gators on " Swamp People" about one shot stops. ALL MOVEMENT STOPS

[JES14352]

All these years and I have never felt under gunned when it comes to caring a .22

[top dog]

Jes,and Uncle Lee,
I agree with you both 1000%!!!!!

I spend lots of range time with my NAA minis and I feel that it is time well spent.

My practice distance is 8-10 feet which is basically the distance actual confrontations take (and most of them far less).

Trust me,a cylinder full of 22LRs or Magnums will put a damper on a bad guy's intentions real quick. If he has a friend,no real problem as that guy would be long gone after the first shot.  There is no honor among thieves.

                                                                                                  Top Dog

[Bigbird48]

 :)Yep I agree also, I've been a lot of places were guys are carrying 45's or 9mm, or what ever and sometimes they laugh when they see my mini and ask whats that gonna do? I say do you want to get shot in the face with it? and their attitude changes real fast. Its kinda funny how many gun carrying advocates don't know how lethal a small 22 is. Granted its not the ideal weapon to have in a life or death situation but it is better then the 45 sitting home in the safe cause its too bulky or to hard to conceal while going out to dinner, or to the Dr's office. Its always in my pocket, even in places were it shouldn't be, and unless I'm going into a federal court house or some other place were they have metal detectors I don't have to worry about finding a place to put it while I'm there.
I don't feel under armed.

[boone123]

I picked up a NAA 22 short in the early 70s, and carried that till, I think, the late 70s when I picked up a 22LR mini, which has been  on my person almost every day since I bought it. I carried them in a folded big red unused hanky in my back pocket till a few years ago when I got a NAA cloth ankle holster which I use every day. I almost always wear boots, so its pretty protected from being seen, or lost. Its been to a lot of states, and hung in there for a lot of miles with two wheels, and four. Most always if I go somewhere  with 4 wheels I also have another gun or two along , because thats the way I am.
I have said this before, and I will say it again, Some of something is better than none of nothing....

If it wasn't for NAA minis, my tripping would be cluttered.

[stantheman86]

I carry my .22 LR Mini nearly everywhere I go...I need to upgrade to a Pug:) I want more punch , a bigger grip and usable sights are a nice option:). The size isn't much bigger than my LR mini but there are far better ammo options in .22 WMR. With LR it's pretty much Stingers as the preferred defensive ammo, or Velocitors.

[top dog]

I think that we all pretty much agree on the same thing and that is that the Mini,whether it be in 22LR or Magnum,whatever NAA model you choose,is much better than the bigger gun back in the safe and not carried.

I think I had mentioned this before,but it might be wise also to have insurance in case you have to use your Mini in self defence.

One insurance is the SHIELD offered through Concealed Carry.org and the other,an NRA endorsed company is Second Call Defense. Both seem to offer very good policies at what seems to be about $300. a year.

You survived the incident,now you have to prepare for the inevitable fallout. Might be money well spent.

                                                                                                            Top Dog

[TwoGunJayne]

The NRA itself offers the kind of insurance you're talking about, don't they? ...or do they subcontract it out?

[OV-1D]

  Nowadays it's better to place your shot for a straight and forward kill instead of maiming the s.o.b. so he can't sue you for being disfigured or handicapped , besides dead men tell no tails . So when the bad guys coming at you ,wait , WAit , WAIT ............ NOW !!!!!! One between the eyes or ears should be sufficient , make it count with your mini , don't want to waste ammo . Happy hunting .    

[stantheman86]

Well no court can accuse you of using too much gun for defense with a .22.......you are an armed citizen who carries a small gun for last ditch self defense.

I know people who carry .44 Mags for CC, would hate to have to defend that in court...it's our right to carry anything we want but the prosecution will rake you over the coals for letting fly with a .44 in a Wal Mart parking lot.

[G50AE]

I know people who carry .44 Mags for CC, would hate to have to defend that in court...it's our right to carry anything we want but the prosecution will rake you over the coals for letting fly with a .44 in a Wal Mart parking lot.

Can you cite a court case that involves this line of argument by a prosecutor?

[Goatpacker]

I know people who carry .44 Mags for CC, would hate to have to defend that in court...it's our right to carry anything we want but the prosecution will rake you over the coals for letting fly with a .44 in a Wal Mart parking lot.
[/quote]


Thats funny!!! I think that if something like that was true then there would be some sort of restrictions on what a person could legally carry for self defense!!! Sad part is that even if you have a carry permit, once you pull the piece and use it in a Walmart parking lot or anywhere for that matter you are going to be up to a fight!!! Permits only give you the right to carry concealed!!! Everyone has the right to self defense!!! You are still left with the burden of proving "self defense"!!! The other side in the court room will try to rake you under the coals wether you used a bazooka or a slingshot!!!

[magnum_mike]

I know people who carry .44 Mags for CC, would hate to have to defend that in court...it's our right to carry anything we want but the prosecution will rake you over the coals for letting fly with a .44 in a Wal Mart parking lot.

To the masses, larger bullet diameter = bigger cartridge. To these clueless people, a 45acp has more killing power than a 44mag. So, that really wont fly.

Several years ago a grocery store robber in the Pittsburgh area was met by a man, who had been hunting but was now waiting for his wife that was inside the place, outside the store with a 44mag. One round from that 44 to the robber's noggin' put an end to the whole situation. The good guy wasn't charged, he wasn't even arrested. No one accused him of killing the bad guy too much. Lethal force needs met with whatever lethal force we can afford to carry upon our person. Heck, I might think about a friggin' RPG if it weren't such a hassle!

[TwoGunJayne]

Depending on the lawyer, they might try to rake you over the coals for using "more lethal" hollowpoints, even though that tends to increase the survival rate. People are idiots and don't realize that since you tend to have to shoot the target more with fmj that it's being "shot more" that's more lethal.

It's the difference between a knockout punch and having to hit them 10 times. The 10-hit beatdown is more likely to be fatal.

[top dog]

TwoGunJayne,
The Second Call Defense is ENDORSED by the NRA. It is the same company that has the NRA endorsed firearms insurance.

The NRA does not handle any applications/claims etc,it just endorses the insurance company that offers it.

The other insurance is the SHIELD offered to members of Concealed Carry.org.

Both companies offer similar coverage but in my opinion,the Second Call Defense looks a little better. Check them both out and see which is better for you.

Another very cheap "insurance" is to purchase the book  "In The Gravest Extreme" by Massad Ayoob,costs about $12. and will probably save you about $100,000. in the long run.

Whenever a pistol permit applicant came to my department,that is one of the first things I recommended they get.

                                                                                          Top Dog

[TwoGunJayne]

...was about to say... then they rake you over the coals for shooting them 10 times with fmj for being "excessive." One blessed way or another, there will be injustice. The legislative and judicial branches will see to that.

By the way, was anyone aware that hollowpoints are illegal for civilians in New Jersey? A Philly lawyer actually asked me what I thought about them being illegal. I didn't know what to say. He only owned three guns, given to him as payment for defending them one time. All unfired. Sad?

Another very cheap "insurance" is to purchase the book  "In The Gravest Extreme" by Massad Ayoob,costs about $12. and will probably save you about $100,000. in the long run.

My personal insurance is living in a strong 2nd Amendment state with Castle doctrine. Since I never really go anywhere but into an unpopulated grassy field, or do anything (like poking someone's wife), I'm not worried in the slightest. Not is my life only extremely boring and nobody's EVER going to come for me... if they did, I could unload a cannon upon them and it would be legal. In addition, I don't really have anything to take. 2 divorces and lawyers saw to that.

Anyway, I can even double up for extra credit and try to give them CPR after I shoot them in my house so they can't sue me for trying to "help them." That is... if the strong state 2nd Amendment fails, the Castle Doctrine fails, at least I can try to stop them from dying on my carpet from being shot once with a proper factory load from an unmodified pistol.

Go ahead, lawyers. This crap might fly in New York, San Diego, or wherever you're from. Not here. Not in my house. Not, in fact, in my state... so there. See someone in my living room that's not supposed to be there, the law says you can literally shoot first and ask questions later. It's a far, far, FAR cry from the garbage in other states of the so-called "Union."

God bless the South. Texas too. Smart people know not to rob houses there. It's playing with dangerous, dangerous fire... particularly with 60% of the people acknowledging pistol ownership in this area, knowing the other 40% are paranoid and lied or refused the survey.

[heyjoe]

there is no duty to retreat in your house in new york.

[TwoGunJayne]

There are so many horror stories from California of the life of an otherwise successful man being ruined. Why? Someone broke in to rob and kill, got shot, then sued the person he was robbing... AND WON.... FOR BEING SHOT DURING THE COMMISSION OF AN ARMED ASSAULT ON AN OCCUPIED DWELLING. Why not rob a California mansion? Get rich either way.

Makes me want to puke. After I'm done with that, it makes me want to slap some people around. Too bad it's not in my state. The "Great Experiment" says I shouldn't go slap a California Judge and demand to know WTF his problem is. Not my Judge.

[ikoiko]

In Ohio, castle doctrine applies to occupied home,  occupied temporary habitation, occupied /car///.
Haven't looked at the actual law/code/statute, so not sure what *car* means in this case.

http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/node/5722

I tend to be very weary of the whole democrat/republican: bad guy/good guy raging debates and rants.

In general, I think of politicians as snakes in the grass. Snakes are fine. Like the ones that eat available rodents and pests . . . not so much the ill tempered and venomous ones.

Ted Strickland, a democrat, signed this bill. So, in at least one case, a democratic snake should not be vilified.

Sorry for the swerve in thread.

[TwoGunJayne]

Summary: Municipal laws are often unconstitional. What I like about the NAA minis is that they often are permissible in some of the most stringent areas. The problem is when carry restrictions punish an innocent or dying man. Here is my story. At time of posting, this happened today.

Most states of which I'm aware, including mine, sadly don't count a bicycle or motorcycle as a vehicle. I may have falsely heard that California doesn't consider an automobile an extension of your home. In my state, it doesn't matter. Carry in your car, carry while traveling. Get a permit and carry more.

The idiot Democrats of my state messed up and allowed "carry in your own home," possibly because they were about to be hung. "Carry in your vehicle," meaning an extremely expensive car was allowed, because the Democrats strangely didn't oppose it. "Carry on a motorcycle?" No way, the Dems squashed that here. Forget a bicycle, you get robbed and killed. Literally. It was the Democrats in this state.

The Libertarians and Republicans then turned around and stuck it in. What I'm about to say probably doesn't apply in your state. "A sawn off shotgun cannot be considered a concealed weapon under the following conditions" Started with the democrat-approved "dwelling," moved to automobile. The next move is "bicycle or any other conveyance." The next move is full legalization. I get a smaller shotgun in my own home. Yeah. Whooptey-doo.

I had to go visit a dying man in a hospital in the capital city of my state today. Really. I seem to be doing this a lot within the past 2 or 3 years. He's a WW2 Navy vet.  Former licensed HAM, former state primitive archery champion, on and on and on. He doesn't know any of that now, any more. I'm aware of only 3 people who were still breathing to shed a tear for him. In local terminology, he's a "stubborn ol' sumbitch." Everything that happened... wasn't his fault. He's got zero quality of life now and I think he gave me his last hug... or one of them. It felt good.

His eyes, normally razor sharp, finally glinted today as he recognized me. His recognition rate of me is about 50/50 for the past 2 months. It takes several tries. This isn't the first time.

Anyway, State law said my pocket knife was "too big," nor can I bring it into a hospital (in violation of the State Constitution and basically the whole State House of Rep,) so I took it off... I'm a law abiding man... and I couldn't even cut up his apple that the stupid hospital people brought him. No knife. What part of "he doesn't have teeth" don't they understand? I can't even cut up an apple for a dying man. Nice going, Judge Crooked. We'll talk about that later. There's plenty of people that want a piece of him first.

Nice job, legislators. Deny a dying man an apple. George Washington himself had wooden teeth or required a knife for such a task. The difference between the California Judge that continually ruins the lives of people for being victims and... this? According to "The Great Experiment," I allegedly have access to these people and can get them disbarred and thrown off the bench. It's inside my state. I'm supposed to be able to visit them and discuss their mistakes. Really. That's part of the "Great Experiment." Anything else is a "lack of transparency," a "lack of accountability" and leads to people making evil decisions with no repercussions, nor any way to fix them.

The shoe is on the other foot when it's in your own state. There's a Judge responsible for this, and I know his name. He's on the sh**list of every libertarian and republican group in the state. Sleep tight, idiot. Sleep tight. Hope you didn't plan to retire as a Judge. Something's going to happen and it won't be me that does it. Too many traffic tickets, your honor? (lower case intended) Doubleplus irony intended. (Sleep tight I)

Unrelated search term: Patriot Guard Riders. What does it mean when you're not a part of the main organization? Sounds Special, doesn't it? People will literally get mad at the legislature over an apple, particularly if the right to that were supposedly guaranteed under the Constution. (Forget federal, we're talking STATE.)

[G50AE]

The other side in the court room will try to rake you under the coals wether you used a bazooka or a slingshot!!!

Especially If the prosecutor is some one like Janet Reno.

[G50AE]

Several years ago a grocery store robber in the Pittsburgh area was met by a man, who had been hunting but was now waiting for his wife that was inside the place, outside the store with a 44mag. One round from that 44 to the robber's noggin' put an end to the whole situation. The good guy wasn't charged, he wasn't even arrested. No one accused him of killing the bad guy too much. Lethal force needs met with whatever lethal force we can afford to carry upon our person.

I actually know a guy from Georgia who killed a crow with a 44 magnum.  No charges were filed BTW.

[G50AE]

Another very cheap "insurance" is to purchase the book  "In The Gravest Extreme" by Massad Ayoob,costs about $12. and will probably save you about $100,000. in the long run.

Whenever a pistol permit applicant came to my department,that is one of the first things I recommended they get.

                                                                                          Top Dog

That's good advice.

[top dog]

G50AE,
One of the best things about the folks in this forum is the amount of solid,common sense advice given.

Sure,there might be a little "rant" here and there but the advice is sound,simple and easy to understand.

Fortyfour years of experience both in the fields in foreign lands and home plus the court room has taught me

to expect the unexpected.

Getting back to the original thought of this thread,when folks come to me to tell me about their newly acquired CCW and ask what they should carry,my advice is to pick out one of the NAA Minis and practice...a lot.

Yes,that super light weight 38/380 etc does seem to get big and in the way when the temps heat up and the dress code calls for less and less garments. However,there is always room for a mini.

Practice distance should be ten feet and less with the emphasis on less.

                                                                        Top Dog

[Bigbird48]

@Twogun
I'm not sure what you meant by this statement?
Unrelated search term: Patriot Guard Riders. What does it mean when you're not a part of the main organization? Sounds Special, doesn't it? People will literally get mad at the legislature over an apple, particularly if the right to that were supposedly guaranteed under the Constution. (Forget federal, we're talking STATE.)

[TwoGunJayne]

For things to change, you must have peacable redress with the folks who think they're in charge.

A knife law preventing a dying WW2 from having an apple when he has no teeth is just the sort of case that makes lawyers and politicans look extremely bad.

It takes a special kind of person to bring words to the government in a way that is heard and acted upon.

I get the impression that nobody's really doing that these days, except for whining for more free stuff. It makes a Patriot pretty ill, a lot of what's going on at the moment...

What's a good, upstanding American to do?

[ikoiko]

2GJ
Sorry for your friend's current state, and sorry you were unable to cut his apple for him. Sad.

I'm a RN and work in the ICU. I carry a Leatherman squirt while at work. Tiny tool, but well made. I've found a need, for a knife blade more than once in my practice, and needs for most of the other tools on the squirt also. I work nights, so we don't have the kind of backup that day shift has, and this little tool has been a blessing for me, my patients, my coworkers and their patients.

For what my 2 cents is worth, so long as your knife is not some monster, I wouldn't be concerned about taking it into a hospital. Don't think any of the nurses would even bat an eye at you using it to cut up an apple for a patient . . . Yes, there are always those that are on a power trip, and nursing attracts a fair number of those, but I would think as long as you were not belligerent, stayed cool, and if need be, ask for the nurse mgr, things would be fine.