Do you carry with the hammer in the safety notch or an empty chamber?

G50AE · August-03-13 20:08

Quote from: TwoGunJayne on August-03-13 17:08
AKA
"Burying money," also known as "Pass the bill."

Or as Jenifer Flowers and Monica Lewinsky would say, pass the Bill on.

mdzcpa · August-03-13 21:08

The hammer is not at half cock when the hammer is in the safety notch. You must pull the trigger while securing the hammer with your thumb as you lower the hammer into the notch. The hammer does not remain in half cock position.

That said, I don't admonish anyone that chooses to carry on an empty cylinder. To each their own. I simply don't see the point in my own personal opinion. Especially when doing so robs you of one valuable chamber with an already diminutive 5 round revolver. But, hey, different strokes as they say.

Uncle_Lee · August-04-13 04:08

Quote from: cfsharry on August-03-13 09:08
The question Dinadan put forth was a good one and the results are about what I expected.
I am suprised, however, by the brain dead orthodoxy of those respondents critical of they who carry in a fashion different from their own.
In my case I am not about to use two different protocols when carrying, one for my mini and another for my pre-transfer bar Rugers.

That is what I am trying to say.........

bud · August-04-13 08:08

TwogunJane,

My deceased Father in Law was a state trooper, and he did that with a 20 dollar bill.

TwoGunJayne · August-04-13 11:08

One of my grandfathers was an Army Artillery Colonel in the US Army. He did his time in WW2, Vietnam, Cambodia, and Korea. (not in that order.) He said he packed a $100 bill with his snub revolver. Once he retired and literally bought a farm (with geese, ducks, deer, cows, and farmland,) he gave up pistols all together. He was a .300 H&H (the real deal) scoped bolt rifle man, assuming he didn't pop with a wood-stocked iron-sight Savage .22lr/.410 OU.

He passed on to God's woods back in the 90s. Some said that that sweet old SOB would never kick the bucket.

He had 3 German Iron Crosses won the American way... taken from enemy troops.

He was one of the finest men I've ever known. Honestly, I feel a bit inadequate compared to his legacy. I've got the last rank insignia he ever wore in active duty. His kids were so evil and mean, this is all I have to remember him.... that and the memory of his stories.

So yea...

These are stores for us gray hairs.

cfsharry · August-04-13 11:08

mdz,
Yeah I know the gun is no longer at half cocked when the hammer rests in the safety notch. But it might as well be as the cylinder is still free to rotate if the hammer is lifted an ever so small amount. As Dinidan rightly pointed out in his post #33, the cylinder stop is not engaged.
With that said and for the record; I have never stated, nor implied, that use of the safety notch was not a good way to carry, only that it was not the way I carried.

Dinadan · August-04-13 15:08

I have heard of keeping the "burying money" in an empty chamber. You would have to seal the front end of the chamber with wax or something to keep it from falling out, I think.

I see that this poll brought out 42 members so far!

kbuzbee · August-04-13 16:08

Quote from: TwoGunJayne on August-03-13 17:08
If we're going "old school" with an empty chamber as the first click past hammer down... aren't you supposed to roll up the biggest cash bill that you have and insert it into those chambers?

AKA
"Burying money," also known as "Pass the bill."

Very cool. Never heard that before.

Ken

Would an actual bill even fit in a NAA chamber? Hmmm....

shwurr · August-04-13 18:08

Both. In a well designed pocket holster that fully covers the hammer, the safety notch appears quite safe. However twice I have foolishly stuck my 22 in my pocket without a holster, jumped on my bike, and on arriving home, found the hammer on a live round. Takes very little pressure on hammer to release cylinder to turn. So...no holster=4 rounds for me. Just sayin for ME. You all know what YOUR nuts are worth.

Steve

nastruck · August-05-13 05:08

WOW I love a great fight!!!!
Almost as much as my mini.... LOL

ikoiko · August-05-13 07:08

Ken
Send me several C notes, and I'll let you know

Mike

Uncle_Lee · August-05-13 08:08

Quote from: nastruck on August-05-13 05:08
WOW I love a great fight!!!!
Almost as much as my mini.... LOL

You ain't seen nothing yet........
Seen some good ones in the past 5 years or so.
It was better on the old forum.

ephraim · August-05-13 09:08

I have used an empty chamber all my life for single actions, and will continue to do so. Dinadan explains the advantage of the cylinder stop very well indeed. My take is, gather information and do what you feel comfortable, unless it makes the person next to you uncomfortable !

adrnln · August-05-13 21:08

I really start to wonder if these types of questions come from those that don't even OWN a mini. The hammer can move and the cylinder can rotate on its own? Sorry , but why do you think the notch is even made or invented? Is this the 1800`s? Should we carry the mini with 4 rounds? Just venting. Carry on.

ikoiko · August-05-13 21:08

Mr Adrnln
Don't think anyone is saying hammer or cylinder are able to move of their own volition. However, moving around freely, unholstered, in a pants pocket, gives ample opportunity for friction in the pocket, against said hammer, in the course of normal personal movement, to allow for the hammer to move from safety notch. Am thinking of a front jeans pocket.

And, yes, I own a "few" minis, and do carry them. It does not, in my experience, take much force to move the hammer from the safety notch.

I either carry them confined in a holster, possibly a thumb break, or somewhat loosely in a pocket-- which as I think of it, may not be so wise.

It is a bit concerning - to some-how small the amount of movement is that is required for the hammer to disengage from the safety slot.

Food for thought, or not. To each his own.

Just a vent also.

nastruck · August-06-13 04:08

I have a question! Even since I bought my mini I have wondered how it is timed to use the safety notch. Now the question of safety notch or empty chamber brings up another question. If you use an empty chamber why doesn't it move to the safety notch when you cock it....

Uncle_Lee · August-06-13 05:08

Quote from: adrnln on August-05-13 21:08
I really start to wonder if these types of questions come from those that don't even OWN a mini. The hammer can move and the cylinder can rotate on its own? Sorry , but why do you think the notch is even made or invented? Is this the 1800`s? Should we carry the mini with 4 rounds? Just venting. Carry on.

Some of the black powder revolvers of the 1800s had the same type of a "safety slot". They were still carried with only 5 chambers loaded.
Some had 12 cylinder bolt slots in the cylinder. The extra 6 locked the cylinder with the hammer between chambers. Those were carried with 6 loaded chambers.
I have over 35 NAA minis.
I carry 2 minis with 4 rounds in each.

swolf · August-06-13 08:08

I carry on an empty chamber. I'm pretty active, and also one who has seen it doesn't take much to bump the cylinder off the safety notch. My worry is getting my neck holster tangled in my t-shirt while juggling an armload of boxes. I would consider the safety notch when packing my BW with the holster grip inside the pants as it doesn't move and pulls straight up to draw. I used to carry a single-shot .45/410 Cobray as my conceal-of-choice, so having "only four" shots isn't a concern for me. I also tend to not go places where automatic weapons confrontations occur, and do not daydream about facing off against a van load of bank robbers.

Dinadan · August-06-13 14:08

Quote from: adrnln on August-05-13 21:08
I really start to wonder if these types of questions come from those that don't even OWN a mini. The hammer can move and the cylinder can rotate on its own? Sorry , but why do you think the notch is even made or invented? Is this the 1800`s? Should we carry the mini with 4 rounds? Just venting. Carry on.

a d r n l n - One of the cool things about single action revolvers is that they are such an old design. The lock mechanism on a given revolver may differ from those made in the 1870s, but the actual loading and shooting has not changed for 140 years. I am only saying 1870s because that is when cartridges were widely introduced. Go back to 1849 and look at a Colt pocket revolver. Once you get it loaded it works just like our Minis. Instead of safety notches it had a little pin between the chambers that the hammer rested on. It also had exactly the same issues that we have been talking about here: when it was on the safety pin, moving the hammer less than one millimeter would release the cylinder to turn: when in was on an uncapped nipple the hammer had to move several millimeters to release the cylinder.

I bet some guys back in 1849 had exactly this same discussion.

Quote from: nastruck on August-06-13 04:08
I have a question! Even since I bought my mini I have wondered how it is timed to use the safety notch. Now the question of safety notch or empty chamber brings up another question. If you use an empty chamber why doesn't it move to the safety notch when you cock it....

nastruck - look at reply #33 in this thread. The cylinder bolt at the bottom of the frame stops and locks the cylinder so that the chambers line up with the barrel. The cylinder bolt engages the cylinder notches, not the safety notches. You can see the cylinder bolt locked into a cylinder notch in the photo below.

scbuxton · August-06-13 19:08

Hey Dinadan in 1849 they would have asked " what's a millimeter? "

All kidding aside, I carry both my BW and my short with all five cylinders loaded, the hammer in the notch but both have the holster grips installed so that the trigger is covered even if the hammer is pulled back. Just an extra layer of protection as I see it. So far I still have both juevos intact and hope to keep them that way.

Dinadan · August-06-13 19:08

Quote from: scbuxton on August-06-13 19:08
Hey Dinadan in 1849 they would have asked " what's a millimeter? "
All kidding aside, I carry both my BW and my short with all five cylinders loaded, the hammer in the notch but both have the holster grips installed so that the trigger is covered even if the hammer is pulled back. Just an extra layer of protection as I see it. So far I still have both juevos intact and hope to keep them that way.

When I started this thread I was not intending to change anyone's carry method. Just wondered how many carried each way. Good point about the millimeters! I recently bought a reproduction 1849 Colt, so I could actually test its action. That is why I specifically used the 1849 as an example.

Uncle_Lee · August-07-13 04:08

I think the main internal difference between the 1849 Colt and the NAA Mini would be the cylinder bolt, cam, & spring.

nastruck · August-07-13 05:08

Ask a simple question get a simple answer. Boy do I feel DUMB! Head down leaving the room!!!!

Dinadan · August-07-13 20:08

Quote from: uncle_lee on August-07-13 04:08
I think the main internal difference between the 1849 Colt and the NAA Mini would be the cylinder bolt, cam, & spring.

Uncle lee - I do not doubt that you are right. I looked at parts diagrams for the NAA magnum and the Colt 1849 and I have to admit that it would take a good deal of study for me to really understand the which of the what.

Quote from: nastruck on August-07-13 05:08
Ask a simple question get a simple answer. Boy do I feel DUMB! Head down leaving the room!!!!

I have asked a few questions like that too. Yeah, I snuck out of the thread too! Fortunately most of the folks here are too advanced in age to remember much about what they read, so I mostly got a pass.

nastruck · August-09-13 05:08

Thanks Dinadan!
The thing is I'm more of a reader then a writer anyway. Should of left it that way, huh?

LOL
I did enjoy this forum (the reading part) thou and my minis....

TwoGunJayne · August-09-13 06:08

Quote from: Dinadan on August-07-13 20:08
I have asked a few questions like that too. Yeah, I snuck out of the thread too! Fortunately most of the folks here are too advanced in age to remember much about what they read, so I mostly got a pass.

Hey, Dinadan! Welcome to the forum! It's always good to see a new face around here!

Dinadan · August-09-13 18:08

I see that 58 members responded to this poll. More than I expected, and with some good discussion too. Results were about as expected, with maybe a couple more folks carrying on an empty chamber than I would have guessed.

cfsharry · August-09-13 18:08

Yah! A good thread. Now we have to identify the guy who carries at half cock and help him understand why that is not such a good idea.

Dinadan · August-09-13 19:08

Quote from: cfsharry on August-09-13 18:08
Yah! A good thread. Now we have to identify the guy who carries at half cock and help him understand why that is not such a good idea.

I think the half-cock fellow would be Maccab. He is in Great Britain and I guess he cannot own a gun anyway.

cfsharry · August-09-13 20:08

Hadn't thought of that. Strange.

Uncle_Lee · August-10-13 04:08

Quote from: Dinadan on August-09-13 18:08
I see that 58 members responded to this poll. More than I expected, and with some good discussion too. Results were about as expected, with maybe a couple more folks carrying on an empty chamber than I would have guessed.

Same results every time.
More said they carry on an empty chamber because more people are here now.
Seems like the forum has more people jumping in here now a days.....

TwoGunJayne · August-10-13 12:08

...and that's a good thing. There's nothing worse than posting alone.

Maccab · August-10-13 14:08

It was I who said half cock, but with the caveat of it being in a special holster.

Then I said empty chamber, then I was like... Well depends if you have a holster.

We can't own Minis here, not sure about the cap and ball ones though, but we can't carry them that's certain.

Very anti gun here, the government etc.

Maccab · August-10-13 14:08

If you have a firearms licence here you can buy reproduction cap n'ball revolvers uberti even new designs I remember a Ruger old army I think they called it for our market. So in theory perhaps we could own a cap n'ball mini, have to have al look never seen one I'd try and get a licence just for one to put in a glass fronted case and show you guys and go Da Da!

I have never bothered with licences "I don't shoot either, just airguns" seems a lot of hassle here, expensive, kinda make you feel like your doing something wrong in asking and they have to begrudgingly answer type thing while poking their nose in all your business.

Plus we don't have semi autos, pistols less fun, might get one one day always wanted a kentucky rifle flintlock, don't hunt anymore, no pellet gun even, was pondering 1O m target air rifles sport like.

TwoGunJayne · August-11-13 11:08

First off, Maccab, I apoligize for getting angry at you that time. Cancer got two and three of my close friends and family made it. I buried one of my old military friends personally. Half of his ashes are "out back." I can "go see him" anytime I want now. One of these days, I'll be laid to rest along side him along with my (still living) former USMC Vietnam forward artillery spotter.

Things are better now. I guess. Some old friends are trying to hook me up with an... older lady. We'll see how that works.

Quote from: Maccab on August-10-13 14:08
If you have a firearms licence here you can buy reproduction cap n'ball revolvers uberti even new designs I remember a Ruger old army I think they called it for our market. So in theory perhaps we could own a cap n'ball mini, have to have al look never seen one I'd try and get a licence just for one to put in a glass fronted case and show you guys and go Da Da!

I have never bothered with licences "I don't shoot either, just airguns" seems a lot of hassle here, expensive, kinda make you feel like your doing something wrong in asking and they have to begrudgingly answer type thing while poking their nose in all your business.

Plus we don't have semi autos, pistols less fun, might get one one day always wanted a kentucky rifle flintlock, don't hunt anymore, no pellet gun even, was pondering 1O m target air rifles sport like.

Remind your local Nazis that the NAA "cap and ball" revolver is a replica of a black powder revolver design from the mid 1800s and it's "pathetic and weak" compared to the modern British military pistols. It's "just a curiosity." Tell them that.

We know better.