is this a real Black Widdow

[brucelee2001]

I intend to buy it from my local gun dealer.  2 inch barrel. Conversion cylinders - cal.  22 mag and 22 lr.
But what is the reason for a slight differece on the  barrel.

Have in mind the only one (hollow) slice existing on the upper front part of the barrel just under the front sight .

What is this revolver ?
I think that The real Black widdow should  have three slices -  except this one we see on the front, two more -
on the middle and rear part of the barrel. This one has only one slice.
For example look at the picture of the three guns bellow the revolver.
  In the middle is the picture of BW. There we see three slices.
What is the reason this item has only one slice ?

I am looking at the firearms list on - naaminis.com .  But I don't find another revolver wih 2 inch barrel and only one slice (hollow) on the front side of the barrel.
May it be some technical issue or something I should worry ?

[brucelee2001]

What I am thinkig is-
These indentations are used to ventilate the barrel.

It is said so in the description of the item (Black widow).

So my concern is- if there is only one indentation for ventilation,
Maybe the barrel could not handle two more indentations to be made with the Lathe.  Or whatever machine they use to make the three indentations on it.
How can I understand what is the exact reason.
I must maybe check up the mollecular structure for being defected?

The cylinder pin is apparently pull down snd slide.
On the product is written -"north american arms Provo Utah 22 magnum".

But where is the place I should look for a State and city where the gun is made. On the gun , or on the box or papers?

[Shovel-ready project]

Hi Bruce,
I am no expert here but I can verify the current BW has three indentations (slices?) along the top strap. Maybe an earlier version had just one. Does your item say 'NORTH AMERICAN ARMS' and '.22 MAGNUM' and a city and state of manufacture? Mine does.

[MR_22]

Wow, that's certainly curious. I've never seen one like that. But it's definitely a Black Widow. Everything else matches.

[OV-1D]

  Hello there and welcome ,question what type of cylinder pin does it have , forward push button or pull down and slide ?

[tocsn40]

I intend to buy it from my local gun dealer.  2 inch barrel. Conversion cylinders - cal.  22 mag and 22 lr.
But what is the reason for a slight differece on the  barrel.

Have in mind the only one (hollow) slice existing on the upper front part of the barrel just under the front sight .

What is this revolver ?
I think that The real Black widdow should  have three slices -  except this one we see on the front, two more -
on the middle and rear part of the barrel. This one has only one slice.
For example look at the picture of the three guns bellow the revolver.
  In the middle is the picture of BW. There we see three slices.
What is the reason this item has only one slice ?

I am looking at the firearms list on - naaminis.com .  But I don't find another revolver wih 2 inch barrel and only one slice (hollow) on the front side of the barrel.
May it be some technical issue or something I should worry ?

The middle one is a black widow.

[theysayimnotme]

I see the three grooves you are talking about but that b rings up the question of what purpose do they serve? They don't remove much weight so are they merely decorative? They must add some cost.

[Scott Free]

Those grooves may help dissipate heat a teeny tiny bit, but I suspect they're there for aesthetic reasons.

[MR_22]

It seems maybe it's just a Black Widow with a birth defect. Perhaps it makes it more collectible--to somebody who likes that sort of thing.

[lefty dude]

A design feature, only. Serves no other purpose. The Wasp also has a vent rib. Sets the piece apart from the round barrel version.

[Shovel-ready project]

Okay, it makes sense now. (Could not see the pics a couple days ago.) Certainly an NAA black widow. Another interesting point is it appears to have a mini master grip. Maybe the smith was feeling creative that day.

If Microsoft made it, that would not be a defect, it would be a special feature.

[grayelky]

If the price is right, buy it and enjoy it. I suspect it is an early version, but I could be wrong. If it were local to me, and the price was good, I would buy it, without hesitation. But then, like Mr_22 mentioned, it is a variation that some who collect curious, and somewhat slightly odd guns, would find interesting. If you were to have an issue with it, it is still a North American Arms revolver, and they stand behind their products.

Is it brand new or used? The grips seem to be from an older gun. If it is a brand new gun, maybe NAA opted to make less machine cuts into the top strap, and, you have one of the first of a new variation!

[MR_22]

If Microsoft made it, that would not be a defect, it would be a special feature.

Indeed! Let's call it a birth feature, then!

[theysayimnotme]

I couldn't see the picture before either. It does have the newer cylinder pin. The thing that would worry me is the $990.00 price tag.

[MR_22]

$990? Wait, what? Where do you see that?

[scbuxton]

Looks like a minimaster that has had the barrel chopped. Notice the difference in the contour of the bottom of the end of the barrel,  definitely not stock. The minimaster has no cuts in the frame above the cylinder.

[MR_22]

$990? Wait, what? Where do you see that?

Oh, it's in the picture.

[cfsharry]

I noted the 990.00 right away but figured that had to be something other than price.
Very interesting as it almost does look like a cut down barrel but why would anyone do that? Looks professionally done if so. Also the grips do appear from a M M but the sights, front and rear, appear to be BW.
Would not be reluctant to buyit due to safety concerns as it is an NAA but I would 'try' to get it cheap as it does not appear to be what it is being sold as.

[MR_22]

I agree, a cut Minimaster is the most logical explanation. Do a visual comparison below. BUT WHY??? Why would anybody do that?

Say this was a Minimaster in California and the user wanted a Black Widow, but a Black Widow couldn't be purchased in California, could you make your own? Hmm, is that a possibility?

Here's something to check: what does the box say, if anything?

[PaducahMichael]

Looks like a minimaster that has had the barrel chopped. Notice the difference in the contour of the bottom of the end of the barrel,  definitely not stock. The minimaster has no cuts in the frame above the cylinder.

+1

[Canoeal]

Looks like a minimaster that has had the barrel chopped. Notice the difference in the contour of the bottom of the end of the barrel,  definitely not stock. The minimaster has no cuts in the frame above the cylinder.

I concur...

[brucelee2001]

The price is 990.00 but the currency is not US Dollars.
My country is Bulgaria in Europe. So turning it in US Dollars  - this is exactly 565 USD.
With the import taxes included in this price , which is written on the label and this price is for the customer,  I think the  price is even low. The price in USA is 300 USD, but here we have import tax to pay.
For example a NAA PUG costs about 685 USD in Germany. In Gustav Jehn gun store. But unfortunately there is no  PUG in the gun store.

So most likely this is a cut MiniMaster.Sounds very logic.
And a little proof for being cut is a scratch on the metal. Which is on the right side of the gun . Just a little right and up direction from the front end of the cylinder pin. This scratch starts where ends the cylinder pin. And is going up and right.

Well I think the best I can do is go again in gunshop and  take another picture of product number on its down side. And send it to NAA Factory by email. Then ask them what was the model when they produced it - either a mini master or a black widow.

Next little feature I want to point is a little vertical slice on the right side of barrel. Just between the cylinder and the mentioned indentation. Does it exist on the original Mini Master. Because I don't notice such a vertical slice on a BW.

I am giving another picture. Of the upper side. If someone has a BW lets compare the front sight.
Because if it is a cut Mini Master it would definately be needed to adjust the front sight on a new place.Backwards from where originally has been.   Maybe take a look from above at the front side will help to see if the front sight was put in the factory or not.

[lefty dude]

Interesting variant for sure, If it is a barrel chop it is a good job.

[Uncle_Lee]

I'll go along with the cut Mini-Master.

May we see a picture of the end of the barrel?

(I am sorry if I missed it."

[OV-1D]

 My bets on the chop job , very well done from what you've shown us need a better look at the barrel end like Unc_Lee has said , but the ends (barrel and retainer pin) both show a curve on the finish ends which I don't believe the NAA's has that look , they seem to be a square cut not rounded . Sure would like to see the dovetail cut for the forward blade and the blade itself . Thanks for the mind work , ha ha .

[boone123]

There was a member of this forum that posted about  cutting off some of the barrel  of a Mini Master. That was some time ago..

[theysayimnotme]

I believe I made such a comment wondering if NAA could replace a Mini-Master barrel with a Black Widow barrel (or even a Pug) for those of us trapped in the Demokratik People's Republik of Kalifornia.
As for the marks noted on the barrel. There are slight marks on the barrels where the barrel is screwed into the frame. When I first noticed it on my Black Widow I thought maybe something was wrong with it.
The line is fairly faint but goes all the way around.

[brucelee2001]

So my next question is what to do.
If I buy the gun is there a risk ?
Maybe the  gun will not shoot very acurate.
Maybe the barrel is wounded from the cut and its shooting resourse (number of bullets limitation) is lower from normally.

If the gun was mini master with 5-6 inch barrel shooting acurately at 30 yards, maybe now its not shooting acurately at 10 yards.
Maybe I must try how accurately it fires , and then buy it. 



I will post some new pictures after 3-4 days. Because it's not in my town.  And we will see the serial number. And I'll try to connect with the producer to ask what was the orriginal gun.

[brucelee2001]

Here it is.
A cut Mini Master.

[brucelee2001]

More photos

[brucelee2001]

Photos

[grayelky]

I'd still buy it, if it checks out ok, mechanically. Here, we have easy access to just about every model made, along with easy access to the factory. In other countries, that is not always the case. It makes sense to cut down a 4" barrel that is too much for pocket carry, if you would have to pay $200-$400 import tax on the 2" gun you really want.

[theysayimnotme]

I'd still buy it, if it checks out ok, mechanically. Here, we have easy access to just about every model made, along with easy access to the factory. In other countries, that is not always the case.

Unless you live in the Demokratik People's Republik of Kalifornia. Then cutting down a Mini-Master to make a Black Widow or Pug might make sense.
I don't think I would be too worried about accuracy. Accuracy & NAA revolvers aren't exactly terms that go together. Since it was cut well forward of the cylinder I can't imagine there would be any problem with function.

[OV-1D]

  Might want to smooth the crown down if not done , helps from bullet tumbling purposes . Mechanics good buy it . Good shooting .