So it appears that, now that I am inching closer to grabbing a Guardian 32, they are all but impossible to find anywhere. 

Thanks very much for checking that.  Nice to see it confirmed.  13-plus ounces puts it right about 2 ounces heavier than a Seecamp, which to me isn't a deal breaker.  Especially since I appreciate some of the features that NAA offers as opposed to the Seecamp. 

Quote from: bearcatter on March-06-23 11:03
If you look at a manual, the 32 Guardian is 13.5 oz empty, 14.8 loaded.....

The 380 is 18.72 empty, 20.80 loaded. That's 5.2 and 6 more than the 32....

So strange, because the web page shows it at 15 plus.  I know it doesn't sound like a big deal, but the difference between 13.5 and 15 plus is significant.  At least for me, as I primarily carry AIWB...often without a belt, and at least fifty percent of the time in workout gear.   

Thanks...that information just pushed me a step closer to ownership....

Quote from: bearcatter on January-02-23 08:01
Snooper and Uncle Lee -  I think we've all given fair assessments. I guess my Guardian will remain in the minority. It's just contradictory that the biggest complaint is the weight, yet there are lots of people who have no problem carrying a 3 pound (loaded) 1911. I don't understand that. A loaded P-32 is 9 ounces, but my Guardian's 15 are worth the pluses to me. A .380 Guardian is 21 loaded, that's getting heavy.

My Zastavas are 26 ounces loaded, size of a PPK, and I would find both a bit much for concealed. It's fine OWB.

Wait...I thought the Guardian was 15 ounces UNLOADED.  Have I had that wrong all along?

Quote from: bearcatter on February-23-23 17:02
.32 FMJ doesn't expand but goes deeper. It's midway of the FBI recommendations. Any bullet that does expand is barely adequate in penetration. .32 doesn't have enough horsepower to do both.

I have no idea how the special SD rounds would feed, or behave inside a bad guy. You can still use them, just be careful each round is all the way back before loading the next one. Me, I'd rather have a narrow 18 inch hole than a slightly wider 12 inch hole.

I believe that the .32 Underwood round has been measured at 13-14" in gel, but your point is well taken.  The problem with 32 is that it forces you to make these decisions...deep and narrow or shorter and wide.  There is really no sweet spot, and you've got the rim lock issue to deal with to boot. It's a shame that the Seecamp forum is down...there are some really good gel tests shared by some members over the years.  I seem to recall that the Fiocchi SJHP did really well...something like 14-15 inches of penetration with a bit of expansion, too.

For all those reasons I'd really prefer 380, but I just don't think that carry weight (not to mention the recoil with a straight blowback pistol, as you mentioned) would really give me what I"m looking for. 

Decisions, decisions.....

Quote from: bearcatter on February-23-23 15:02

So far as rimlock, I've never had it happen, and I even use slip on mag loaders. Magazines are sized for the full overall length of FMJ ammo. Hollow point ammo is a little shorter, and the extra space can allow the rim to snap over the previous round's rim when loading. You have to be extra careful. So FMJ is better for SD, and avoiding rim lock. Hollow points in Guardians of either caliber are generally pointless for SD, because they expand very little if at all.

Yes, but using FMJ only precludes what are, IMO, two very good rounds in .32: the Underwood Xtreme Defender and the Buffalo Bore hard cast flat nose.  The former, in particular, really makes the 32 a formidable SD ammo.  I suppose I could always load one in the pipe and one on top of the magazine, and then fill the rest with FMJ.  But those FMJs and their wire-thin wound tracks really bum me out....

Quote from: bearcatter on February-22-23 23:02
With my two, you can say three that run right. Was yours a .32 ? A few other members have Guardians.

Not really a gasket, just a rubber washer that fits under the grip screw. They are included with new guns, and when you buy a set of grips. I feel sure NAA would sell (maybe free) the washers separately. The added friction on the screw makes it less likely you would overtighten the grip. I tighten my factory grips snug plus a bit extra. The screw stays put.

Myself, I just can't do polymer. The Guardian being all stainless works for me, and I like .32 ACP. I have some compact .32 Yugoslavian pistols that shoot very comfortably.

Thanks for that explanation.  Very helpful.

My Guardian was a 32.  Unbeknownst to me, I bought a rather old model, and it quickly developed/revealed some mag release issues.  It was dropping mags with any hotter ammo, even after I stuck to the flat-base-plate magazines.  And then the mag release basically disintegrated into several parts.  NAA was very good with their CS and got it fixed up, but by then I had bought a Seecamp and decided to just move on from the Guardian.  Big mistake.

My inclination is to get another 32, but I've been considering the 380.  I would really like to avoid the rim lock issue with 32 ammo--is that a thing with Guardians, as it is with my KelTec P32??--and the added horsepower would be nice.  But I'm an old retired guy now, and spend at least half my days in workout gear, and I think the 380 might be a bit too heavy to carry on the waist on those days. 

Timely thread for me.  I had a Guardian about 5 years ago, but at the time it just didn't seem to fit a niche.  And, yes, I've regretted it ever since.

I've reached a point--after carrying a big service pistol all day, every day--that I just don't have the tolerance for big EDC pieces anymore.  And while I have a lot of excellent polymer guns (to include a little gem of a P32), I much prefer the solidity of steel guns.  And while I am fond of revolvers, I just tend to shoot semis better.

Which brings me back to Guardians.  I came here to see what current owners think, and it was nice to hear of one that runs just right.

May I ask, what is the issue with the rubber gaskets?  And where do you purchase them?

I'm interested to hear as well.

I owned an older Guardian years ago, and have regretted selling it.  I own a Seecamp, but hate the finicky ammo preferences.  Would love to get a 32 acp pistol that a) looks nice, and b) shoots whatever I feed it.

Has this been sold?

I'd love to hear a range report when you get a chance.

I'm currently wringing the kinks out of an old Seecamp that I bought, but if I can't get it running 100% then I intend to look for a Guardian. 

If you are looking at grip options, you might want to check out designergrips.com.  Great looking grips, and a good guy to deal with. 

Just got off the phone with NAA. 

Cor Bon is no longer making the 25 NAA, and NAA no longer has any available for sale.

However, they are currently working with another manufacturer, and they hope that the testing will be done shortly, and the round available again for purchase within 60 days.  They intend to announce availability on the website once the process is complete.

Quote from: Warthog on April-07-19 18:04
I have 2 boxes of 25NAA ammo.  Sold the gun but the person told me they could get all they needed from the guy at the range.  They then asked me for the ammo, they thought plain 25 acp would work, despite my telling them it would not.  By the time 5heyvwanted the ammo, I had misplaced it, found it again but now no one wants it.

Hey, keep me in mind if you ever want to sell it.  If I keep scrounging ammo from here and there, maybe someday I'll have enough to buy the gun!!

Thanks for all the responses, guys.

I'm not a reloader, so commercial purchase is the only way to go for me.

I like the suggestions re buying the rounds first, and then search for a Guardian. 

I think, at this point, that I'll probably give NAA a call and see what they have to say about ammo availability moving forward.  I don't imagine that this is a gun I'd tend to shoot a lot...plenty of other pistols for range time...so I wouldn't need thousands of rounds to get me through the foreseeable future.

Still, at this point with what I've learned, I'm leaning toward the .32 acp.  Plentiful ammo, both for range practice and for SD. 

I'm starting to see a few Guardian .25 NAA pop up for sale online.  I've always been interested in these, but they have typically been hard to find. 

My concern is the availability of this proprietary ammo.  A quick ammoseek shows none available, but the Guardian product listing says that boxes can be bought through NAA. 

Does anyone here own one, and if so what can I expect if I decide to take the leap?

That's gonna make pocket carry, uh...challenging?

Quote from: thingmeister on March-24-19 20:03
i can make you a set of any size, shape, or wood you like. Just let me know!

Will do...I'll be in touch as soon as I figure out which NAA I'm going to buy.  Thanks!!

Curious...what is your asking price?

I'm not in Colorado but I am in the market for a Sidewinder, and I would pay for the shipping LGS to LGS.  (I've done it at least a hundred times, on both ends of a sale, and it is relatively simple.)

Thanks for the responses, guys.

Looks like there are some great options out there.

Quote from: top dog on March-20-19 07:03
Bosco,
That is smart thinking,guarding your dogs.

If possible,would you think of also having some good Bear Spray?  May be a good idea if you live in a congested area where use of a firearm might cause some concerns.

Just a thought.

                                                                            Top Dog

Great idea.  Thanks.....

Quote from: Canoeal on March-19-19 09:03
The new name for the cross breed is Coywolves and yes they are becoming more prevalent in the East.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/coywolves-are-taking-over-eastern-north-america-180957141/

I live in New England, in a suburban neighborhood that abuts hundreds of acres of woodland. 

Last summer, we got a little puppy to keep our family dog company...they are both "Teddybear Hybrids," little fur balls that are mostly indoor dogs who use the backyard--with an Invisible Fence--to run around and do their business a few times a day.  Because the little girl--about 7 pounds at most--is still a puppy, she needs to go outside every few hours, including twilight and the middle of the night.

Several months ago, right at dusk, I noticed a shadow along the edge of our lawn.  It was gone before I could discern what it was, but I mentioned it to my wife, and she said she'd seen the same thing.  A few days later, she showed me a picture from her cell phone...a coyote standing at the edge of the woods, but one considerably bigger than anything I'd seen before...this one looked more like a wolf than a coyote.  And my wife said that it noticed her but didn't run off...it just circled the area, seemingly looking for something.

I'm convinced that this is one of those hybrids, and that it is stalking our dogs.  Now, whenever the dogs go outside we stand guard, and I am always armed when I take the dogs out at night...even in my pajamas.

I just can't seem to shake the idea that I absolutely MUST own a NAA revolver, and I'm in the process of figuring out what meets my needs. 

Although I like the fact that the Sidewinder gives me a tactical reloading option, I've really been drawn to the looks of the Bugout II, as well as the stock big dot front sight.  But I'm not a big fan of those rubber grips...for purely aesthetic reasons, of course.  Just wondering if they are removable/replaceable? 

Quote from: linux_author on March-19-18 09:03

if you don't want to worry about 'rimlock,' either use FMJ, or research which JHP rounds are 'longest' in your desired 'power' - (IMHO, Buffalo Bore has a lot of folks 'buffaloed' by touting +P for .32acp)

my KT P-32s (three) have all been flawless out of the box, and offer lighter recoil than the Guardian (which is blowback with no ejector)

the Guardian has been problematic, but seems to be functioning 'OK' after a trip back to the mother ship

Thanks.  I don't believe the BB is anything magical...to me it just appears to be a rather hot .32 (especially compared to the Gold Dots and other tepid rounds I have to feed my Seecamp).  And I do like the flat nose for wound channels.

I'm quite pleased with my P32, as well...I was just looking for a SS pistol, frankly just for aesthetics!  I also seem to have a problem with rear pocket carry (my preference for these little pistols) with the P32...either because of my build or choice of clothing, the P32 is just big enough to stick out the top of my back pocket, or to flair the pocket enough to allow the pistol to be visible.  The Seecamp is just enough small enough to avoid this, and I assume the Guardian would be, too.

Would you mind sharing what problems you had with the Guardian?  And when you say it is "OK" now, does that mean 100% reliable, or are there still some issues?  I won't carry a pistol that isn't 100%, so this is really an issue for me.

Quote from: ikoiko on March-19-18 06:03
Roguets1 and linux_author have guardians. Linux_author also has the keltec.

Flyerwire for hollow points in keltec.

http://www.1bad69.com/keltec/flyerwire.htm

Also, keltec owners group.

https://www.thektog.org/forums/p-32.86/

Thanks.  I'm actually a member over at thektog.  Great site.  Unfortunately, I'm not comfortable installing the flyer wire.  I know KT used to actually sell one, but it appears that's no longer the case.

Hey, everyone.

I owned a Guardian last year, sold it because I had too many pocket guns already, and immediately regretted my decision.

I'm considering grabbing another one, most likely to replace my Seecamp, a gun I love but which has far too small a selection of ammo from which to choose.  A couple of concerns:

1)Before I make the move, I'm curious as to what ammo you Guardian owners use for EDC?  My recollection is that they don't tend to be too ammo-picky, but I want to make sure.

Ideally, I'd want to carry the Underwood EC round.  Second choice would be a hot FMJ ammo, or perhaps the Buffalo Bore flat-nose round.

2) Has anyone experienced rim lock with the Guardians?  It's a concern with the Kel Tec P32, which somewhat limits ammo choices, and I'm hoping it's not as prevalent with the NAA.

Thanks for any help you can provide.....

Quick story:  I bought a P32 back in circa 1998 because I needed a pocket BUG while I was on duty as a Federal LEO chasing fugitives. The little pistol did its job for almost 20 years, and then started having failures when the disassembly pin started walking out.  I shipped it back to Kel Tec, and they advised me that it was irreparable, and that they were sending me an brand new P32 with a serial number similar to my old one...FREE!

Around this time I'd also bought an NAA used...a little harsh to shoot, but I loved it.  Unfortunately, I had one nagging issue after another.  NAA was good about the issues and worked to rectify them, but when all was completed I'd lost faith in the pistol and was just waiting for another malfunction.  So I sold it at a considerable loss.

Meanwhile, my new-ish P32 is running like a champ, crazy accurate (on a lark I decide to shoot at a "Bad Guy" target's weak hand from 7 yards, and the Kel Tec tore it up!). I still really, really want to own an NAA, but I'm not convinced it will ever come close to the P32...which, yeah, is an ugly little thing...a face only a mother could love.  But it's 7+1, reliable, easy to shoot, light and thin.  Maybe sometimes looks don't win out?

Pistol has sold.  Thank you.

Price drop.  $200 plus shipping.

Rhode Island.  I'll ship FFL to FFL.  If you're worried about the cost of shipping (last time I ask my LGS they quoted $35) we can talk about splitting it.

After a lot of deliberation, I've come to conclusion that it's time to sell my Guardian 32 acp.  Love the little gun, but I can't see it filling a carry niche and I don't keep safe queens.

It's in great shape, rarely fired (I'm the second owner.  Bought it barely fired, and I've only put 60 or so rounds through it.)  It comes with one flat-based magazine and one magazine with the finger rest.

$250 plus shipping.  Money order, cashier's check, or Paypal will work.

Another update:  My newly-repaired Guardian came back from the factory (1 week turnaround...awesome customer service!) and I took it to the range to see how it fires.

Well, it no longer drops mags, and no longer stovepipes the last live round.  To add icing to that cake, it also reliably handles the Underwood Extreme Cavitator in +P (which turns this .32 into a serious self-defense pistol, imho).  I had some primers that didn't ignite on the first strike, but I think that was an ammo issue since no such problems cropped up when firing Fiocchi or other brands.

Quote from: theysayimnotme on December-06-16 02:12

Quote from: boscobarbell on December-04-16 19:12
Quick update:  My Guardian came back from the factory, and--for a short time--reliably fed the Underwood rounds.  They are very snappy, and my hand wasn't overly happy with the experience, but they cycled just fine.

Unfortunately, some nagging problems with my Guardian returned.  It is still dropping mags, and stovepipes the last live round in every magazine.  So...back to NAA for a little TLC.

I remain optimistic, though.  And if I can carry a fully functional Guardian loaded with the Underwood rounds, I'll be a happy camper.

I assume you mean it stovepipes AFTER the last round is fired. That is not a malfunction. It is my understanding the there is no ejector & the remaining rounds in the magazine serve that function.

No, I am familiar with that feature.  My pistol fires the next to last round, and then stovepipes the last live round in the magazine.  Very, very strange. 

I just got word that my Guardian has been repaired and should be back with me by Thursday.  From the list of repairs, it sounds like I'll have a pretty much brand new pistol, not to mention the significant amount of fluff 'n buff done to the original parts that remain.

I'll report back after I get it back to the range.

So, an update.  Last Friday, the Taurus Customer Advocate called to provide me with the update she'd promised.  She advised that the pistol had been repaired and was on its way to me.  Not two hours later, FedEx delivered my TCP to my door.

So, all's well that ends well, I suppose.  Although I still think Taurus should have just avoided the whole hassle and repaired the pistol under warranty without all the drama.

I haven't had a chance to shoot it yet to see if the repairs took care of the issues, but I've got my fingers crossed.  It sure is a sweet little piece.

In my quest to find the perfect BUG/light carry pistol, I purchased a Taurus TCP 380 during the summer based on some positive internet reviews. I took it to the range and was unable to successfully cycle more than a couple of rounds consecutively. Failure to feed, stovepipes, light primer strikes, etc etc etc. After no more than 20-25 rounds the trigger refused to reset, which ended that day's session.


I took the pistol home, disassembled it per the manual, and was unable to find anything to explain the issues (I was thinking I might find some factory sludge gumming things up, but that wasn't the case). I contacted Taurus customer service and explained the malfunctions...they promptly sent me shipping information, so I bubble-wrapped the pistol components and shipped it back in its original box.


Yesterday, almost 7 weeks later, I received a call from Taurus telling me that I'd voided the warranty by disassembling the pistol, and that I'd be charged a $35 bench fee as well as the cost of a new sear (which, apparently, was the cause of the trigger malfunction). I flipped out at the customer service rep and reiterated that I'd only disassembled it per the manual to clean the pistol. He curtly responded that a "customer advocate" would contact me within 24 hours.


Well, I just got off the phone with the "consumer advocate," who basically only reiterated that I'd voided the warranty. I explained, again, that I'd only taken apart the pistol per the manual. But she claimed that the gunsmith noted evidence that I'd attempted to "remove the frame pin."


So, for the second time in 24 hours, I flipped out on a Taurus representative. I denied ever touching the frame pin, pointed out that they'd now had the pistol for 7 weeks, during which time it had been handled by Taurus employees and diagnosed by a gunsmith who found the broken sear...if someone had touched frame pin, it wasn't me. And I told her that I was astonished that this is the way her company has chosen to treat a customer who bought a brand new product under warranty that failed to operate from the first magazine fired.


Her response? She was going to take my statement back to a gunsmith supervisor to discuss my case. I ended the call by telling her that they can discuss it all they want, but they won't be receiving a penny from me, and that--as far as I'm concerned--they can just keep that piece of junk.


This is the worst example of customer service I have ever experienced. I'd heard some stories about Taurus before, but nothing prepared me for this level of indifference and antagonism towards their customers.


I bought a used Guardian that has required a little TLC from NAA, and customer service has been courteous and professional.  What a stark contrast.

Taurus?   Never again.

Quick update:  My Guardian came back from the factory, and--for a short time--reliably fed the Underwood rounds.  They are very snappy, and my hand wasn't overly happy with the experience, but they cycled just fine.

Unfortunately, some nagging problems with my Guardian returned.  It is still dropping mags, and stovepipes the last live round in every magazine.  So...back to NAA for a little TLC.

I remain optimistic, though.  And if I can carry a fully functional Guardian loaded with the Underwood rounds, I'll be a happy camper.