Both of NAA's "proprietary" Caliber Guardians

[Rick_Jorgenson]

These are unusual caliber guns and don't come up very often for sale.

The .25naa caliber Guardian and the .32naa Guardian

Again, many thanks to Uncle_Lee for making them available and allowing them to come to Phoenix AZ knowing that they will be well cared for 

Now... to hunt for ammo! 

[bearcatter]

Good luck on the ammo. It's hard enough finding any regular 32 and 380 these days.

[Uncle_Lee]

You are VERY welcome.
Those Guardians are no longer made.
Neither is the ammo.

[Rick_Jorgenson]

Good luck on the ammo. It's hard enough finding any regular 32 and 380 these days.

Regular .32 & .380 are no trouble for me, I have plenty of that and keep some on order all the time.
This NAA "special" stuff will be a little harder! lol!

You are VERY welcome.
Those Guardians are no longer made.
Neither is the ammo.

  I'm going to give them a cleaning and lube tonight!

[RogueTS1]

Get yourself some Reloading Dies Rick. Only way you are going to be able to feed those two. 

[Rick_Jorgenson]

Get yourself some Reloading Dies Rick. Only way you are going to be able to feed those two. 

I should start looking for those 

[ds10speed]

I've always liked the idea of those custom calibers and would be cool to own those.

[Rick_Jorgenson]

I've always liked the idea of those custom calibers and would be cool to own those.

I've seen magazine articles about these calibers, they seemed to like them.
I'm hoping to be able to try them out!

[OV-1D]

  25 ammo is readily available , myself have not found any difficulty finding that one anyhow . I think its a great round for close quarter usage , it comes in hollow point also . Dang I wish I had the bucks I would have liked that one .

[bearcatter]

The Guardians in this thread shoot the special bottle-necked .25 NAA and .32 NAA. Cor-Bon was the original maker, but they don't do it anymore.

[ds10speed]

If it was possible to get dies, can you resize .32 and .380 brass to make them?

[bearcatter]

I found some Google posts about CH4D being the only ready made dies, but that Lee will make them on request for about the same price. Just relaying what I read, but it would be worth contacting Lee to see if the info is correct.

EDIT:
Lee shows a mix of single tools in a custom section of their website. A little unclear as to what is available. I'm not a reloader, so you guys that are know what you're looking at better than I do.

Hornady's website has a custom section showing several complete 3 and 4 die sets. It states that they require a spent casing and other info.

Maybe this will help someone.

[heyjoe]

i always wanted the 25 NAA, liking the 25's in general, i have 5 of them, and the 25 NAA being small and unique. I was in a gun store one day and had one in my hand that had a discounted price because it wasnt moving. I came very close to buying it but i knew with only one manufacturer of ammo it was not going to end up well.

I have bought new caliber hand
guns before, like the .327 magnum, but i knew if that did not catch on you could still use the 32 long, 32 S&W, and 32 H&R Magnum in it, so it wasnt a gamble. The only thing you could use in the 25 NAA is 25 NAA.

[bearcatter]

I found a place with .25 NAA for $3.75 per round, yes, per round. You do get a choice of 35 grain JHP or 50 grain FMJ !

https://www.shop.ammo-one1.com/25-NAA-North-America-Arms_c61.htm

Also has .32 NAA for $3.95 per round. This one says maximum order is 3 rounds. Crazy.

https://www.shop.ammo-one1.com/searchquick-submit.sc?keywords=.32+NAA


Old posts from Jessica, about the NAA ammo in June 2019. Apparently no longer true.

The 25 NAA is no longer being loaded by ANY commercial ammunition manufacturer, according to North American Arms. The only company that was loading it was CorBon, & they also confirmed that this ammunition is no longer in production.

I approved this message in case anyone is interested in purchasing. However, the first sentence is incorrect. NAA DOES currently have a vendor producing and providing the .25NAA ammo and will soon be doing the .32NAA.

True, CorBon is no longer making the ammo for us, but another supplier is and we currently have 50 gr. available and will continue to. FYI, I've been with company for 11 years running customer service and recently sales, I'm not just a moderator...

......Good Luck !......

[OV-1D]

   After reading all this I didn't realize the their 25 cal. also is a specialized round for NAA's gun . I retrack that wanting of one after all . Why would anyone make a gun , not alone two calibers, for the public , that takes its own specialized cartridges ? Boy ,that would leave one bad taste in my mouth not being able to find ammo and the company decided not to make it anymore also . Pretty expensive paper weight .
  I wonder if 40 cal. will become extinct if the future .

[bearcatter]

There are enough 40 pistols on the market I think the ammo is safe enough.

I would have maybe bought a .25 ACP Guardian if there had been one. I just wanted to avoid dud rimfires, which was John Browning's reason for inventing the .25 cartridge. He wanted a dependable .22 but it wasn't big enough to make it centerfire.

[Rick_Jorgenson]

......Good Luck !......

Thank you? I guess?

   After reading all this I didn't realize the their 25 cal. also is a specialized round for NAA's gun . I retrack that wanting of one after all . Why would anyone make a gun , not alone two calibers, for the public , that takes its own specialized cartridges ? Boy ,that would leave one bad taste in my mouth not being able to find ammo and the company decided not to make it anymore also . Pretty expensive paper weight .
  I wonder if 40 cal. will become extinct if the future .

Not being available does't mean it can't be made.  That makes it a challenge! lol!
I can still fondle them until I can shoot them 
Plus... They were Uncle_Lee's so the "Historical value" is through the roof! 

[OV-1D]

  Sorta like National Treasures , I forgot that fondling part , your right .. Ha,Ha ,Ha .

[Wumbey Goomba]

I would be all over a Guardian in 25 acp.

[KEN AR]

I've been a reloader for way over 40 years.   At near $4 a round I would think someone would be offering to modify some parent cases and then load up some of these.

Reloading for resale gets into some ATF stuff I don't want to mess with but it sounds like even being able to neck down the parent brass is something that may be needed since there are so few original rounds produced.

I read all the reviews and yes they do seam to have much better performance than the original 25 and 32's.

[bearcatter]

I found this article about the development of the .25 NAA. Points out two issues in reloading. The .32 ACP case is semi rimmed. The .25 NAA case is rimless. A photo in the article illustrates the difference in diameter. Article also says the NAA case is longer than the ACP, in the last two paragraphs of Page 1. So, it's not just a matter of necking down a .32 ACP case for the .25 NAA.

This photo shows the difference in case length, .25 NAA and .32 ACP side by side -



Article -

https://northamericanarms.com/pdfs/news09.pdf


Another article, on development of the .32 NAA.

https://northamericanarms.com/pdfs/lao32naa.pdf

This article says development started with a slightly longer case, but they must have changed that in the final design. The photo below shows both the same length.

Comparison photo .32 NAA and .380 ACP -

[Uncle_Lee]

Just for looking at.

[FailedFusion]

I would be all over a Guardian in 25 acp.

I would also be really interested in 25 acp Guardian.

[RogueTS1]

It appears reloading for the .32 NAA would simply be a matter of necking down/resizing the .380 acp brass. Not so much with the .25 NAA. 

[bearcatter]

The.25 NAA would be a challenge. There may be work arounds for those issues, but I wouldn't know, not being a reloader.

[Wumbey Goomba]

I am all de-loader.

[Rick_Jorgenson]

Here is what I have found out as of today...

Starline Brass does not have it. I figured that but needed to start somewhere     https://www.starlinebrass.com/

Huntington Dies does not have sets for the NAA calibers and is no longer taking special orders.  The tech on the phone suggested calling Hornady and Redding.  I went to their websites and since I know about 1/10th of a percent about reloading had no idea what to even ask for if I called them.  The more I learn, the more I realize how much I don't know about reloading! lol! 
   
http://www.huntingtons.com/store/
https://www.hornady.com/reloading/dies/custom-dies#!/
https://www.redding-reloading.com/

Ken AZ (Forum Member) suggested I call Lee  https://leeprecision.com/  I'll try that tomorrow to see if I can speak to a tech
After explaining to Ken that the .25naa Brass looked "taller" than the .32acp Brass (Uncle_Lees Photo) he suggested that when "necking" the brass down the excess brass has to go somewhere so that may explain the additional height (stretching)

I also called NAA to speak to Jessica but she is out of the office this week so I'll try to contact her next week to pick her brain a little 

I did find a good You Tube Video from Brownells that gave me some hope this brass can be made... 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHndMidl5x8&t=152s

[bearcatter]

I feel sure it can be figured out. I've never reloaded, but my brother had a room full of reloading gear years ago. I picked up some basics watching him. It would be nice if someone had done it and posted how somewhere. Maybe one of your contacts will lead to that, or the contact may know how.
I know there are other cartridges that can be necked into something else. I've heard that all cartridges stretch when they are resized back to original diameter. That also thins the case wall. That's why brass can only be reused a limited number of times. Any excess is trimmed off.
I hope the info I dug up helps, especially reply #20 above. It shows the length and rimmed / semi-rimmed differences.

Keep us posted !!

[Rick_Jorgenson]

I feel sure it can be figured out. I've never reloaded, but my brother had a room full of reloading gear years ago. I picked up some basics watching him. It would be nice if someone had done it and posted how somewhere. Maybe one of your contacts will lead to that, or the contact may know how.
I know there are other cartridges that can be necked into something else. I've heard that all cartridges stretch when they are resized back to original diameter. That also thins the case wall. That's why brass can only be reused a limited number of times. Any excess is trimmed off.
I hope the info I dug up helps, especially reply #20 above. It shows the length and rimmed / semi-rimmed differences.

Keep us posted !!

I've stayed away from reloading on purpose... I always said I didn't need another hobby. 

These two guns have given me a reason to pursue reloading  lol! 

[bearcatter]

I admire your determination. I have trouble making myself drive 8 blocks and back for 6 bags of groceries ... 
Running out of leftover pizza is my only motivation ... 

[OV-1D]

  MY kinda guy , "PIIIIIZZZZZZZAAAAAAA" is my lifeline to the next day . YUMMMM . Even make my own with English muffins and all the dressings . YUMMMMMM again .

[bearcatter]

Sam's Club deli has several 16 inchers for ten bucks. Plenty of topping, ready to eat. I get what they call the "Four Meat". Are you drooling yet? ... 

[OV-1D]

  I don't know Bear I'm a pizza lover , I'm real particular when it comes down to pizza and or Chinese foods . Theres a Italian restaurant/bar just a few blocks away no less thats got the best so far from the bazillions of pizza joints down here , seems everyone THINKS they can make pizza's "NOT" . Funny the Italian food at that same place is terrible as my tastes go I figure the place is so full at times I figure the bar carries them thru . The wife isn't so much a pizza eater but SHE even thinks its O.K. , in other words real good in her language ...................... P.S. I use to own a pizza place ,while working Grumman in the day, most raved about it but I didn't like it so much .Ha .

[bearcatter]

We are really drifting here. I like really thin and crisp crust. Been a long time since I had that. I settle for sort of thin and slightly limp ...

[OV-1D]

  I must admit I'm the wanderer can't help it ,off on a cloud somewhere . Can't help relating to so much , you guys and gals I presume, cover so many subjects . Heck on the phone its hello and goodbye no more no less no matter who it is pretty much . Seems typing is a following it turns out , still one finger though , ha ,ha ...