4" Mini Master 22LR -- VERY Disappointing Accuracy...............

[Old No7]

Well gang, you may have seen a recent post of mine where I'd acquired a decent used 4" Mini Master with the thinking that it "...Just might be capable of picking off a partridge or squirrel at up to 30 paces when I'm out deer hunting in the Maine woods."

That ain't gonna happen.........................

I tried 5 different 22 loads in it today; 2 standard velocity (Wolf MT and CCI Std) and 3 high-speed (CCI, Blazer and Federal) and this target was the best 20-shot grouping of all.

At 10 yards -- only 3 out of 20 shots would have hit the head of a partridge...



The problem is -- that target was shot at only 5 YARDS...

Look, I know this isn't a target revolver... And I do know how to shoot handguns well (as I once placed 2nd in Maine in 22LR Bulls-eye Postal Matches, all shot 1 handed).

* * * But am I expecting too much of a NAA to use it as a small kit gun? * * *

I am still intrigued by their designs, the quality of the fit & finish and the well-executed Swiss Watch-like construction.  They do go "bang" when the trigger is pulled -- yes -- but all the built-in quality is for naught if they won't HIT well...

At this point, I'd rather carry my 4X heavier 5" S&W Mdl 63-5 and at least HIT what I'm aiming at...

On that other posting, I had mentioned I was thinking of selling off my Ranger II but my getting the Mini Master had me interested in the NAA line all over again -- but seriously, now I'm thinking that I could have TWO NAAs going up for sale very soon...

I have tried SO hard to like these niche NAA mini guns -- but it's just not happening...................

Old No7

[PaducahMichael]

I'm sorry the little guys are not working out for you. They do require some practice to shoot accurately - are you sure you're not throwing in the towel too quickly? It took me a good while to get familiar enough with them to be accurate. You already own them - and seem to admire them - so why not give yourself a chance to get better with them?

[Dinadan]

I have never shot a Mini Master so I cannot speak about it from experience.  Did you shoot the Mini Master one handed as in your match shooting? Did you shoot from a rest as well? Based on my experience with other NAAs, shooting from a rest can really help determine whether the inaccuracy is inherent in the Mini or the shooter. I guess in a way that does not matter a lot, if a person cannot hit what he aims at with a particular gun. I consider a couple of my Minis to be quite accurate, but I would not plan on eating partridge if I depended on my Mini to provide it. For what you want a Ruger Bear Cat would probably be a better choice.

[Mr.Mini]

It took some time for me, but the accuracy is coming. Good thing .22 lr is cheap! All these shots were about 10 yards or so.

[Uncle_Lee]

You mentioned that you bought it used.
Maybe that is why the first person let it go?

[Uncle Fatso]

I remember seeing your post about using a NAA MM as a "kit gun" for head shooting grouse, and thinking that there's no way any of my NAA's are accurate enough in my hands to reliably head shoot small game even at 20'.

I can usually hit a rattler close enough to the head to kill it at 6', but that's about it.

[OV-1D]

  Old No7 that's why that model comes with adjustable sights I suppose . None of these guns are really set up for target shooting unless those adjustables are present . Everyone has to consider the price of what you paid for just what you are getting . Still a good looking piece .

[Canoeal]

Call NAA and  ask if they will go over it. It couldn't hurt...

[bearcatter]

Do you have, or can you rig, a rest for it? Over the years I've had several questionable handguns, shooting badly in some way. A rest answers the "is it me, or the gun?" question. Most of my issues turned out to be me, and giving myself more time kept the guns in my collection.

A second option is to let someone else shoot it a cylinder or two, and compare results.

[Fharing]

            2 things that come to mind over the years of owning minis.
First even with oversize grips, are they tight fitting on the frame? My black widows sometimes needed paper shims in the grip to tighten them up.
             The other issues I had were the sights themselves, they simply did not stay put. Set screws, locktite, they still shifted in the dovetail. The only cure I found was in the 2000 series locktite,(they use 2000 series on space shuttle reentry tiles), if you use that route they are not removable.
               Most of my accurate naa shooting is related to the exact same grip pressures on the grip. That's my challenge. Don't give up on them, nothing comes close as far as portable, if you can master them.

Just my opinions

[heyjoe]

how does the crown look.

[lefty dude]

By looking at your target ; you are letting the muzzle drop as you pull the trigger. The Mini does not have a hunting or target trigger. You must practice, and concentrate on a steady two hand hold. Think like you have your hands on a fence post, while pulling the trigger with no movement of the piece in your hand. Use a tight two hand lock-up.
Forget the HV stuff. CCI standard Velocity is your best bet for accuracy in the Mini. According to your target, a couple of CCI SV bricks and you will be there.

Good luck!!!

[top dog]

Old#7,
In my experience,most,if not all NAAs will shoot better than most folks can hold.

Did you clean the bbl thoroughly and make sure any previous leading has bee removed??

Now here is a trick I learned recently especially dealing with today's 22 lr ammo which seldom has good or sufficient lube.

Try a mere swipe of bullet lube such as SPG or any other cast bullet lube (even Johnsons Paste Wax might do,I use it) on the bullet.

It takes me about ten minutes to prep about 100 rounds.  In my case the results were fantastic.


I am sure that soon you will be able to take small game while on your deer stand in Maine.

                                                                                                                                       Top Dog

[billmeek]

You do realize that the sidewinder is available with a 4 inch barrel:

https://northamericanarms.com/shop/firearms/naa-sw-4/

[billmeek]

And if you are interested, here's a good price on the 4 inch SideWinder combo:

https://www.gunsmidwest.com/sidewinder-22lr-22mag-swing-out-4-bbl-5rd.html

[Warthog]

Well, that isn't good than your MiniMaster wasn't good for shooting accurately,  I love mine and it is the current winner for range use for me.

A 4 inch Sidewinder would be a cool lillte piece but I don't have one of them, I have a HogLeg with a 6 inch barrel that seems to shoot well so far, but you have to remove the cylinder for reloading so i am not sure if it would work well for you.  Anyway, it isn't hard for me to conceal and I am certain Rick J could make you a dandy holster for it too.

Picture below shows my Hog Leg and one of my Earls.

[Kevin55]

how does the crown look.

My first thought, if it isn't the shooter.
There were some issues with Minis key holing targets. The crown on the muzzle wasn't properly shaped.  The factory fixed them.

[OV-1D]

  Welcome Shap but on that gun don't hold your breath . Myself I'm still not pleased with how the cylinder doesn't swing open enough to use a speed loader . AND IT COULD DANG IT !!! But who am I to suggest to NAA about mods . Again WELCOME ABOARD THE NOT SO LOVING LOVE BOAT OF MINI'S .

[billmeek]

Have you checked with the NAA Custom Shop to see if they could and would fit the Marble Arms Sights to the Sidewinder?

[Uncle_Lee]

  Welcome Shap but on that gun don't hold your breath . Myself I'm still not pleased with how the cylinder doesn't swing open enough to use a speed loader . AND IT COULD DANG IT !!! But who am I to suggest to NAA about mods . Again WELCOME ABOARD THE NOT SO LOVING LOVE BOAT OF MINI'S .

.32 acp mini !!!!

[Bernie707]

Old No. 7, I hear you. I'm on the verge of buying my first NAA mini 22, and I believe they are generally well made like the proverbial Swiss watch, since everyone says so. But I'm not expecting very good accuracy - especially since I'm limited to a 1.25" barrel in either the base model LR or magnum, since that's all current CA law allows. I just want one because it's the smallest gun out there and I'll be able to carry it regardless of my apparel for the day. I do think the recommendation of sending it in to NAA is a good one in the event it could come back with better accuracy. Let us know what you come up with.

[RICKS PLACE]

I will probably get pounded for this reply, but having owned many NAA"s over the years, I never bought one for accuracy.  I consider them for across the room (max) last ditch defense guns and carry one or two of mine daily.  Accuracy wise, don't try to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.  For handgun accuracy I have a pair of old 6 in S&W K Frame revolvers (one 38 sp and one .22) that I used in competition back in the early 70s. Both guns still shoot better than I ever could.  As one poster already put it, the NAA trigger let off is just are not up to it.  The small grip even with oversized grips are not up to it.  NAA is not known for crowning the barrel all that well and I have had to have at least one NAA recrowned to stop bullet tumble.  I will stick to what each gun is designed for and not expect my Honda CRV to keep up with my Mustang.   

[OV-1D]

  Well Rich I'll stand beside you on this fact , a belly gun is a belly gun and nothing else . Magnum or long rifle or short for that matter doesn't increase the gun potential in design . Longer barrels of course will improve distance for some but gripping of gun still isn't where it needs to be for accuracy . Without bench pads theres no target shooting abilities for 97 % of us .

[riadat]

All my naas will hit a person in the head from 5 feet.

[OV-1D]

  Shap your correct that the longer barrels are more accurate , we are just saying we, at least I ,don't believe NAA made any of their mini's for being of any great accuracy no matter what model . I think they made them only for being different for their product line , maybe some thought was in there with the adjustable sights but mainly still short range belly guns in all . Just an opinion , maybe Sandy can kick in and give us his actual thoughts about his line .

[bearcatter]

I think this was several years back, it doesn't give a certain date (copyright 2006), but .17 guns and a .32 H&R Magnum revolver are mentioned in the whole interview, here:

http://randywakeman.com/sandychisolminterview.htm

Part of a Guns and Shooting Online round table with Randy Wakeman, Senior Editor of Guns and Shooting Online:

Sandy Chisholm: "Randy, ours is a very niche-oriented business whose entire reason for being is personal protection. These firearms are not designed to be target-grade, although some people have managed to achieve some extraordinary results. Nor are they intended for hunting, although there are plenty of snakes and varmints who wish they were still around to attest to that (actually, I hear many stories of hunters who carry them to dispatch wounded or trapped animals)".

[pennsy]

I consider mine to be a "get off me gun" but Hickok can hit the 80 yard gong.
https://youtu.be/R9WTwSvDP8s

[RICKS PLACE]

I had said my piece and would normally not add to this, however Sandy made a statement re not really a hunting item.  Some years back, I was watching some series re swamps in (I guess Louisiana) and the hunter used a NAA Mini to dispatch a gator.  Very close range.  At that range, I would want a .44 mag, But the Mini did the job.

[Honky Tonk Man]

Funny thing happened to me yesterday.  I went to the local indoor range and decided to practice with the .22 LR cylinder in the Black Widow.  This particular range has crummy lights over your sights, and I really have trouble seeing them.  I probably averaged about a 5", 5 shot group at 15 ft, taking careful aim.  Pretty bad, I know.  For the last 5 or 6 cylinders; I fast drew from my pocket, and emptied the gun as fast as I could.  I didn't use the sights, just pointed at the bullseye and let 'er rip.  My groups tightened up to about 3" !!  I didn't see that coming. 

With my other combo guns, I shoot better with the .22 LR cyls. than with the magnum, just the opposite with the Black Widow?  No clue why.  I'll be honest with you; I'm no Elmer Kieth with the mini's, but I'm confident I can shoot minute-of bad guy if the need arises. 

[Canoeal]

While I can hit a target the size of an 8" dinner plate out to 20 yds., I consider mine a "get off me" too...

[Uncle Fatso]

It seams like several of the responses to this thread discussing accuracy are relating other NAA mini revolvers to lack of accuracy to the mini-master.  I am sure the really short barrel minis have terrible long range accuracy.  However, a 4" riffled 22lr revolver should have good accuracy at least out to 30 to 40 yards+ as long it has good sights and is otherwise precision made.  The mini master has good sights and is 4" long.  While it is small, I would not characterize it as a belly gun.  Mine is very accurate.  I actual bought it to take grouse and generally target shooting/plinking.  Which it does well.  This is not a conceal carry belly gun for me.  I do not use this firearm for conceal carry at all, nor do I intend to. It seams like a lot of the folks on this forum are concerned with the conceal/cary ability of the NAA minis and the ability to conceal carry and effect for self defense ranges.  I am not interested in the mini master for this use at all.   Those responses above that are from folks that have not actually shot an NAA mini-master are ill informed on its accuracy potential.

Shap

Seems like you got an unusually good one. Be glad. Mine isn't as good.

[Bernie707]

Unless you're buying the 4" mini master 22 for it's looks or to add to a collection, I would be looking at 9m, 38 or 45 if I was willing to accept a 4" barrel in a handgun, personally. But to each his own. These days it's hard to have too many guns even if you don't use them all - they are a non depreciating store of value.

[5_shooter]

I would check the barrel to see if it had decent rifling. I have a 3" Earl that had almost no rifling. Sent it back to NAA and they put a new barrel on it. When I got it back, it shot 3" left at 7 yards. The end of the barrel was cut crooked! I had a piloted 90 degree cutter, so I recut the end of the barrel and recrowned it. Now it shoots good. One thing I haven't seen mentioned is the trigger. The triggers on minis are heavy. Light gun, heavy trigger- extremely hard to master. Hard to pull the trigger without pulling the front sight off target. I have found that shooting at paper with these can be disappointing. But I was really surprised how accurate these can be shooting at targets of opportunity. Like pine cones, pieces of clay pigeons, etc. especially with a dirt berm where you can see where your bullets are hitting. I have no experience with BW or MM, but I have with the Earl, and Wasp. The sights work okay on these models. The models with the half moon front sight don't work at all for  me. It takes a lot of practice, and a lot of concentration to shoot very well with these, but it is possible if the barrel is okay, and the cylinder is in time. Brownnells sells a tool to check timing. Invaluable if you have a lot of revolvers.

[OV-1D]

  I realize that the triggers on all mini's are kind of heavy but on such a small piece I wouldn't have it any other way , grabbing the gun quick or slow with light triggers pull will most likely get yourself shot by your own gun  . Just reaching into your pocket to retrieve could be worrisome and hurtful .

[5_shooter]

I agree.  Small gun, spur trigger, it needs to be heavy. Thats what makes it challenging to shoot accurately. But it can be done. It just takes a lot of practice.